Re: Fwd: Re: [EVGRAY] General info!

https://www.alibaba.com/showroom/peltier-chip.html    Thay, I have had 
an account with Alibaba for many years and have ordered sample 
quantities of items from them. I really don"t know what the difference 
is between the refrigeration and generator chips. May be something in 
the semi-conductor material used.   Alibaba is the cheapest source of 
the Peltier Junctions that I have found.  I got a ton of the Marlow Ind. 
chips via salvage of Medical equipment and main frame computer systems.  
Regarding the black body solar panels, please go back and read the 
various articles that I have posed on my research. Recent break through 
on black body technology is fantastic.   The latest from Industry is a 
total efficiency of greater than 99 percent absorptive!  Thay!  do your 
homework and read all the references to get the whole picture!

https://www.aremco.com/news-item/new-hie-coat-840-c-high-temp-black-body-coating-offered/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_body

Long, long ago I read an interesting article regarding the behavior of 
infrared radiation and quickly picked up on the fact that photons in the 
infrared / far-infrared region of light cannot penetrate a collector 
glazing at acute angles. 45 degrees or less.  A black body surface is a 
near perfect receptor as well as a near perfect emmiter of photons.  
Proof of this is the fact that you can make ice on a clear sky over 
desert with a black body emmiter. The radiation into space of the IR 
band photons leave the surface in a gross negative state thereby 
creating temperatures below freezing. (Read my article What is Heat) The 
secret is in ionization phenomenon.  Now let's look at the powerful 
ionization rays of full spectrum sun light. When the sunlight penetrates 
the glazing of your solar collector and strikes your black body receptor 
surface ,said surface becomes ionized gross positive due to photon 
re-emmision in the far infrared and infrared spectrum. The preponderance 
of this re-emmision from the black body surface is at 90 degrees to the 
surface. Hmmm.   Now understanding that the infrared spectrum cannot 
penetrate the glazing (re-emmision, you just make your collector surface 
into 90 degree trouths (  so that re-emmission is at a 45 degree angle 
to underside glazing angle of incidence.  A quarter silvered tempered 
glazing is real important here.  The collector is super efficient when 
you encase the whole thing in thermal foam to prevent heat losses due to 
overall collector heating. The unit that I built was a zeolyte based 
collector and the super thermal efficient design sent the operating 
temperatures over 200 degrees and shattered the glazing. The collector 
back plane was made from a 4ft. X 8ft. sheet of mild steel bent in a 
metal break with 8 inch wide 90 degree troughs which gave me a IR 
re-emmision angle of incidence of 45 degrees (perponderence)  You have 
now cut your losses of energy to the lowest possible.  The application 
of the Peltier chip coating (array) to the front side and circulating 
cooling water or air to the backside of collector plane will give you 
more than 100 degree thermal differential across the chips thus yielding 
a very efficient overall collector. 10X greater output over photovoltaic 
collectors. Sure the cost is much greater but good investment. See: 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_internal_reflection
https://physics.ucf.edu/~rep/publications/JournalPubs2010/ClearyGrating2010.pdf

On 1/16/2016 10:06 AM, Norman wrote:

PS:

Natural infrared

Sunlight, at an effective temperature of 5,780 kelvins, is composed of 
nearly thermal-spectrum radiation that is slightly more than half 
infrared. At zenith, sunlight provides an irradiance 
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irradiance>of just over 1 kilowatt 
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilowatt>per square meter at sea level. 
Of this energy, 527 watts is infrared radiation, 445 watts is visible 
light <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visible_light>, and 32 watts is 
ultraviolet <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet>radiation.^[10] 
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared#cite_note-10>

On the surface of Earth, at far lower temperatures than the surface of 
the Sun, almost all thermal radiation consists of infrared in various 
wavelengths. Of these natural thermal radiation processes only lightning 
and natural fires are hot enough to produce much visible energy, and 
fires produce far more infrared than visible-light energy.
If you are going to collect it you have to know what you are dealing with!

On 1/16/2016 10:01 AM, Norman wrote:

Back in the "day" 1996 when we were doing the "Elemental Replication/ 
"holy water" experiments, the two Texas Instruments Chemist present told 
of how they created a "black-body absorber" by acid etch burning of hard 
chrome that produced a "blackest black" that you will ever see. Totally 
absorbed all light with no re-emission at all.  This really "intrigued 
me for I was designing a very special "flat plate" solar collector, the 
design of which no one had thought of!  The design of a collector that 
has "zero" re-emission means that you capture all of the solar influx 
energy with practically no loss back to the atmosphere other than the 
modest heating of the surrounding housing material.   If you are 
interested in the possibility of a Peltier Junction Collector, it is 
wise to read the following document. 
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy02osti/31267.pdf
There are other "tricks of the trade" which most "solar guys" are not 
aware of.
Of course you cannot even think of designing "the perfect collector" 
without reading and totally understanding the subject of absorption/ 
re-emission.  Best start is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared
"Enjoy"!    Norm

On 1/15/2016 1:46 PM, Norman wrote:

Moray!  Here is a rundown on the use of the Peltier Junction Chips from 
back in the 60s.    See; 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Dynamics_Electric_Boatwhere large 
8 ton capable solid state cooling  (very compact) units were used on all 
the nuclear submarines since they had plenty of power available and 
these units took up very little room. ( I have numerous photos) Second 
generation computers and electronics used them for the obvious reasons 
due to compactness.  Salvaging out of this old technology was done to 
recover the tons of 6061 extruded cooling and heating finned sinks. The 
Peltier chips went into a  bin where I got thousands of them for the 
taking.  I sold them for a buck apiece to my friend at B.G. Micro here 
in Dallas for he had customers waiting to get there hands on them. The 
wholesale price to Industry was at the time about $7.00 for the large 3 
sq inch chip. The small chips were about $5.00.  If the Electric Boat 
Engineers had known about the "reverse" process, they would have bonded 
via heat sinking putty the array of chips directly to the "cold" outer 
hull of the submarines and supplied a volume of steam to the hot side to 
deliver a tremendous amount of electric power from the vast area of the 
metal hull. "Just saying"!  Lol   To answer your question, since there 
is  such a tremendous output/ sq. meter the Peltier solar panels would 
be well worth the investment. There are many ways to get the needed 
"heat differential" of which I can see your "brain massaging  as I write 
this"!  Since the chip construction is mostly ceramic & metal alloy 
construction, they can take a heat input much greater than I used and 
would give many times the power output. I can envision the development 
of a panel of similar dimensions as the solar panel with a continuous 
laminated membrane of the required semiconductor component to provide 
approximately 10 kw from 1X2 meter surface collector operating at 180 
degrees under the glazing glass.   Ground cool sinks could provide the 
cooling water at near ambient temperatures!   "Dead Nuts" simple! Norm
Roughly figuring, even using the Marlow Peltier large chips @ 3 sq, in. 
(1550 sq, in. / meter sq.)  = 516 chips x $5 =  $2583 for a yield of 
greater than 655 watts/ meter sq.  Ain't shabby!

On 1/14/2016 9:59 PM,  Mbking42 wrote:

Norm,

That is creative! A Peltier junction solar heat to electricity converter.
How cheap can an array of such junctions be made? Would it be 
significantly cheaper than today's solar panels?
Good idea, Norm!

-Moray

-----Original Message-----
From: Norman <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
To: Mbking42 <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; jongen422 
<[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; jerrrysmith 
<[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; jsstone05 
<[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
Cc: jdecker <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; 
patrickgbailey <[email protected]> 
<mailto:[email protected]>; mleclair 
<[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Thu, Jan 14, 2016 8:38 am
Subject: Re: Vortex cavitation energy

Moray!  "total agreement" here!   Here is something to "ponder"! While 
studying Victor Schauberger's Implosion Vortex which I incorporated into 
my Patent of the Hydrogen Generator, I naturally had to understand the 
complex Hilsch tube vortex generator and how through "ion separation" at 
tremendous rotational velocities of over a million rpm caused the more 
dense, negative ionized air to migrate to the core discharge and exit as 
sub zero flow while the "positive ionized air swirled with high heat 
gain and exit at the hot air discharge port creating a mass flow 
proportion of 75% cold air discharge compared to a 25% hot air 
discharge. Heat differential ( this device) 40 degree F. cold air vs 270 
degree hot air discharge from an input  of 25 CFM @ 100 PSI, 100 degree 
F. air.  Different devices produce much colder  and greater 
differentials.  Now when you consider that a "plasmoid" is a, "As you 
just pointed out",  "A poloidal rotation closing into a toroidal 
rotation, a spiral closing on itself".   I perceive the rapidly rotating 
plasma toroidal ball as a complex implosion vortex (multiples) with a 
core of heavily "negative ionized particles" with an outer mantle of 
highly ionized "positive" particles.  The infolding super high speed 
rotation causes the "charge separation. The "positive" outer mantle give 
the appearance of a "positive" event when in reality the core is 
"Negative".  and more dense.  The implosion vortex proves this to be true.
Please give the following some thought!
Back in the early 90s I wrote a small piece on my ideas as to "What is 
Heat"???  I posted this to KeelNet with no response. Since I was doing a 
lot of salvage work on 1st & 2nd generation computer equipment I was 
able to accumulate hundreds of Peltier Cooling Chips which are 
manufactured by Marlow Industries here in Dallas.  If you can provide a 
DC current across this device and get "ion separation", a hot side and a 
cold side. it would be 'logical" (as Spock would say) to assume that a 
temperature differential across a junction device like this will yield a 
DC current @ a given voltage i.e. wattage output.  BTW, all of this was 
posted to the KeelyNet after I performed the experiment with "no 
comments"!  I carefully set up a "hot" sink of heated water pumped 
through a copper block (hot side) and a "cold"" sink, with normal tap 
water flowing through a copper block on cold side!   Here are the 
results of the Peltier Junction Chip output.

Peltier Junction, small chip, 1.25" X 1.25" = 1.5625 sq."  I used 
several different heat/cold differentials to provide a wattage output graph.

116 F. -  65 F. =   51 F. differential =  .35 A  @   .63 VDC = .22   watts
119 F. -  63 F. =   56 F. differential =  .40 A  @   .69 VDC = .276 watts
158 F. -  63 F. =   95 F. differential =  .70 A  @ 1.21 VDC = .847 watts
163 F. -  62 F. =  101 F. differential = .80 A @  1.29 VDC = 1.03  watts

Peltier Junction, large chip, 1.75" X 1.75" = 3.06 sq"

127 F. -  65 F. =    62 F. differential =   .80 A @   .62 VDC =   .496 watts
134 F. -  63 F. =    71 F. differential =   .90 A @   .70 VDC =   .63   
watts
142 F. -  63  F. =   79 F. differential =   1.0 A @   .76 VDC =   .76   
watts
150 F. -  63  F. =   87 F. differential =   1.2 A @   .86 VDC =   1.03 watts
157 F. -  62 F.  =   95 F. differential =  1.22 A @! .93 VDC = 1.13 watts
162 F. -  62 F.  =  100 F. differential = 1.35 A @ 1.0 VDC = 1.35 watts

Now consider that the "accepted" solar heat influx, full daytime 
sunlight is approximately one kilowatt / square meter.
Photovoltaic solar collectors are just breaking the 10% efficiencies of 
converting the solar input into electrical output which means that they 
are achieving approximately 100 watts per square meter of collector surface.

 From the above Pelteir Junction table you can do a quick calculation 
and realize that the output is vastly superior to solar!
The small chip puts out .659 watts / square inch X 1550 square inches / 
square meter = 1021.765 watts / square meter @ 101 F. differential.

The large chip puts out .44 watts / square inch @ a temperature 
differential of 100 F. yielding (1550 square inches / square meter) 
683.8 watts / meter square.  Quite a difference compared to the 100 
watts / square meter for solar collectors.    Any heat source with an 
attendant cold sink can provide electric power  via Peltier Junction far 
superior to solar cells.

Flat plate collectors in direct sunlight can achieve collector 
temperatures close to 180 F. so with a cold sink maintained by ambient 
temp water you can greatly outperform standard solar collection 
performance.     I think "Spock" would agree!

My ideas as to just "What is Heat"!    Crude by thought provocative!   Norm

What is Heat #2

For about 10 years I have been studying the effects of

heating and cooling associated with the phase change of

liquids with the hope of building a simple generator of

electrical power around the phenomenon.The reason for this

interest is based on the theory that energy can be extracted

from the ambient background via thermal differentials.My

line of thinking really took off back when I experimented

with the all too familiar Peltier junction devices found in

electronic cooling devices.Would you believe that most

people do not understand how these devices move thermal

energy through a current flow across a semiconductor

junction.Historically we find thatGerman physicist,

Thomas Seebeck back in 1820 observed that when heat was

applied to a junction of copper and steel wire that

electrical energy resulted.Later in 1834 Jean Peltier

discovered that when a direct current was applied to two

dissimilar metals the junction got hot or cold.It was not

until 1838 that Emil Lenz clearly showed the importance of

both Seebeck and Peltier s discoveries by placing a drop of

water on the junction of dissimilar metals which froze then

melted when the polarity of the direct current was

reversed.These discoveries remained dormant for over 100

years because of the unavailability of semiconductor

materials which could provide the wide temperature

differentials.In the 1930 s semiconductor materials became

available which revived the electric cooling principles.In

the 1960 s many companies began building spot cooling

devices and refrigerators based on these effects using a

junction material of bismuth-telluride. Today more advanced

materials are used with the basic parameters of being a pore

thermal conductor but being an excellent electrical

conductor. The dissimilar materials must provide a high

coefficient of voltage temperature relationship.The first

Peltier devices that I experimented with back about 10 years

ago were built by Marlow Industries here in Dallas.With a

small temperature differential across the device a weak

current with an attendant voltage was developed.Increasing

the differential provided a proportional increase in current

and voltage.About 6 years ago I posted a chart of the

wattage generated from two different size Peltier chips on

the KeelyNet BBS.My curiosity was based on the puzzle of

how electron flow could move thermal energy across the

junctions and how electrical energy was produced by moving

thermal energy across the junction.This is a directly

reversible situation based on polarity.

Now let us look at a very familiar parallel process used in

refrigeration, cooling and heating devices employing phase

change material such as water and refrigerants.We have

always been led to believe that evaporating water provided

cooling effects which is a mechanical process. By the same

mechanical process we are provided heating effects by the

condensation of a gas back to a liquid phase change.Would

you believe that any material that undergoes a phase change

provides an attendant electrical effect.Back in 1840

Armstrong invented an electrostatic generator based on

escaping steam through insulated nozzles which provided one

of the most powerful devices of this type ever built.

Popular belief was that this was a frictional process with

the electrical output resulting from the steam friction

passing through the nozzles.After reading an old (1920 s)

Thermodynamics in Chemistry text book I realized that the

phase change of materials was an electrical phenomenon and

not purely mechanical.The atoms of the material lose or

gain electrons in the process which accounts for the

discrepancy in the energy equation when a material

transitions between phases.More energy is present after

the phase change back to the lower form or atomic state. The

text book stated that this phenomenon could not be

explained.When Jerry and I attended a Conference hosted by

Hal Puthoff down in Austin back about 6 years ago a

physicist from Austria presented a paper on the phase change

of water and the attendant electrical phenomenon which is

totally not understood by modern science.Now my suspicions

were confirmed that phase changes of materials are an

electrostatic phenomenon, which leads us to the fundamental

question of,What is heat?We were told in theschool

that heat is the presence of energy and cool is the absence

of energy.What is the form of this energy?Let us look at

a very simple example of heating which may explain this

process.When sunlight strikes an absorbing surface it is

heated because electrons in the material are converted to

photons which are emitted in the infrared band of light

leaving the material in a net positive state or hot.The

more electrons a material looses the hotter it becomes.Now

the inverse situation is explored by evaporating some water

from the surface of a material which leaves the surface in a

net negative state or cold.Heat or cold is based on the

ion relationship in the material.When we apply a flame

(ionizing) to a material we cause the emission of photons

which is basically stripping away electrons from the atomic

structure causing a gross net positive situation to occur.

Now we are getting a picture as to how an electric current

across the Peltier junction can transport thermal energy

(ions).Since the energy is in the form of presence or

absence of electrons then it is a simple explanation as to

how the process works.All phase change processes work the

same way basically via ion transport and are not mechanical

processes which we were taught.Everythingin chemistry is

an electrical or electrostatic process at the atomic level

based on the ionized state of the atoms involved.

At a Vanguard Science Roundtable discussion several years ago

we talked about the ion wind method of fire fighting in

which ionized air will extinguish a flame because of the

cooling effects.Now we see Patents issued based on

negative ion spraying of a surface causing it to rapidly

cool because it becomes net negative charged.This is a

very efficient method of air conditioning because an ion

generator operates at very high voltages with very little

current involved.It is possible to develop this ion

transport (thermal energy) to provide direct electrical

output from very subtle temperature differentials.Remember

that this is a direct reversible process where a thermal

differential will cause a development of current and voltage

as in the Peltier device.I hope that this dialog will

provide some food for thought out there on the KeelyNet.

Please provide some feedback on this very interesting line

of experimentation.Norm


BTW, when the Patent Office started researching "Super Conductivity" 
they ran right into Tesla's work with the idea of using the Linde, 
liquid air process to provide a super conductive Tesla Coil primary.   
Tesla understood the power of a "Cold Sink" with electron densities of a 
very high order! "Hmmmmn"!



On 7/10/2018 5:01 AM, Thaelin [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>
> Hi Norm:
> I have a few of these that were in the ice chests and such. You 
> mention that some are coolers and others are generators. Can you 
> elaborate on what the differences are? For someone out in the rough, a 
> solar panel is a dead give away you are there. A black surface in the 
> same area would be hard to notice if you were not really looking. This 
> tech perks my interest for LV generation.
>
> thay
>
> --------------------------------------------
> On Mon, 7/9/18, Norman Wootan [email protected] [EVGRAY] 
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [EVGRAY] General info!
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Monday, July 9, 2018, 2:26 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Warren, I put together a one square ft. laminated
> panel that had
> 100 Peltier chips that proved the concept and yes,
> they do produce
> 10X more output per square meter of collector surface
> over the
> photovoltaic collectors with just the differential of
> 100 degrees
> F. It would take a pilot program funded to make sheets
> of these
> junctions.  Dollars $$$$. Purchasing the Peltiers
> from Alibaba,
> China is the lowest prices I have found for the
> Generator chips.
> (bulk buy).   BTW! They do make both chips,
> refrigeration and
> generator versions.  Norm
>
>
>
>
> On 7/8/2018 12:36 PM,
> Warren Keillor
> [email protected]
> [EVGRAY] wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Norman
> If
> we can
> make test units, it would be good.
> Cheers
> Warren
>
>
>
> Sent
> from Yahoo Mail on Android
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 at 11:43 AM,
> Norman Wootan
> [email protected]
> [EVGRAY]
> <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I am searching my files as we
> write
> looking for Peltier tables of
> output. If
> sheets of bonded junctions
> would be made,
> this approach has 10X energy
> output over
> the photovoltaic approach per
> square ft.
> of space.  Uses only temp
> differential
> from the ambient
> environment.
>
>
>
>
>
> On
> 7/8/2018 2:54 AM, Warren
> Keillor [email protected]
> [EVGRAY] wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Norman
> You
> have written the best
> essay on this
> subject I have ever
> read.
> What
> an interesting concept,
> well
> researched.
> By
> carefully stating the
> subject, you
> also leave the door open
> to further
> research on a collective
> basis, for
> a group effort to build
> practical
> applications.
> This
> paper deserves
> recognition in a
> serious scientific
> journal.
> Cheers
> Warren
>
> Sent
> from
> Yahoo Mail on
> Android
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, 7 Jul
> 2018 at 8:56
> PM, Norman Wootan
> [email protected]
> [EVGRAY]
> <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Try
> this one:
>
>
>
> What is
> Heat
> #3
>
>
>
>
> For about 10
> years
> I have been
>
> studying the
>
> effects of
> heating and
>
> cooling associated
> with
> the phase
> change
> of
> liquids with
> the
> hope of
>
> building a simple
>
> generator of
> electrical
> power
> around the
>
> phenomenon.
>
> The reason
> for
> this
> interest is
> based
> on the
> theory
> that energy
> can be
> extracted
> from the
>
> ambient background
> via
> thermal
>
> differentials.
>
> My
> line of
>
> thinking really
> took
> off back when
> I
> experimented
> with the all
> too
> familiar
>
> Peltier junction
>
> devices found in
> electronic
>
> cooling devices.
>
> Would you
>
> believe that most
> people do not
>
> understand how
> these
> devices move
>
> thermal
> energy
>
> through a current
> flow
> across a
>
> semiconductor
> junction.
>
> Historically
> we
> find that
> German
> physicist,
> Thomas
>
> Seebeck back in
> 1820
> observed that
> when
> heat was
> applied to a
>
> junction of copper
> and
> steel wire
>
> that
> electrical
> energy
> resulted.
>
> Later in
> 1834
> Jean Peltier
> discovered
> that
> when a direct
>
> current was
>
> applied to two
> Dissimilar
> metals
> the
>
> junction got hot
> or
> cold.  It
> was
> not
> Until 1838
> that
> Emil Lenz
>
> clearly showed the
>
> importance of
> Both Seebeck
> and
> Peltier s
>
> discoveries by
>
> placing a drop of
> Water on the
>
> junction of
>
> dissimilar metals
> which
> froze then
> Melted when
> the
> polarity of
> the
> direct current
>
> was
> Reversed.
>
> These
>
> discoveries
>
> remained dormant
> for
> over 100
> Years because
> of the
>
> unavailability of
>
> semiconductor
> Materials
> which
> could
>
> provide the wide
>
> temperature
> Differentials.
>
> In the 1930
> s
> semiconductor
>
> materials became
> Available
> which
> revived the
>
> electric cooling
>
> principles.
>
> In
> The 1960 s
> many
> companies
> began
> building
> spot
> cooling
> Devices and
>
> refrigerators
> based
> on these
>
> effects using a
> Junction
>
> material of
>
> bismuth-telluride.
> Today
> more
>
> advanced
> Materials are
> used
> with the
> basic
> parameters
> of
> being a pore
> Thermal
>
> conductor but
> being
> an excellent
>
> electrical
> Conductor.
> The
> dissimilar
>
> materials must
>
> provide a high
> Coefficient
> of
> voltage
>
> temperature
>
> relationship.
>
> The first
> Peltier
>
> devices that I
>
> experimented with
> back
> about 10
>
> years
> ago were
> built
> by Marlow
>
> Industries here in
>
> Dallas.   With
>
> a
> small
>
> temperature
>
> differential
> across
> the device
> a
> weak
> current with
> an
> attendant
>
> voltage was
>
> developed.
>
> Increasing
> the
>
> differential
>
> provided a
>
> proportional
>
> increase in
>
> current
> and voltage.
>
> About 6
> years
> ago I posted
> a
> chart of the
> wattage
>
> generated from two
>
> different size
>
> Peltier chips on
> the Keely Net
>
> BBS.   My
>
> curiosity was
> based
> on the
> puzzle
> of
> how electron
> flow
> could move
>
> thermal energy
> across
> the
> junctions and
> how
> electrical
> energy
> was
>
> produced by moving
> thermal
> energy
> across the
>
> junction.  This
> is a
> directly
> reversible
>
> situation based on
>
> polarity.
> Now let us
> look
> at a very
>
> familiar parallel
>
> process used in
> refrigeration,
>
> cooling and
>
> heating devices
>
> employing phase
> change
>
> material such as
> water
> and
>
> refrigerants.
>
> We have
> always been
> led to
> believe
> that
> evaporating
> water
> provided
> cooling
>
> effects which is a
>
> mechanical
>
> process. By the
>
> same
> mechanical
>
> process we are
>
> provided heating
>
> effects by the
> condensation
> of a
> gas back to a
> liquid
> phase
>
> change.  Would
>
> you believe
> that
> any material
> that
> undergoes a
> phase
> change
> provides an
>
> attendant
>
> electrical effect.
>
> Back in
>
> 1840
> Armstrong
>
> invented an
>
> electrostatic
>
> generator based on
> escaping
> steam
> through
>
> insulated nozzles
> which
> provided one
> of the most
>
> powerful devices
> of
> this type ever
>
> built.
> Popular
> belief
> was that
> this
> was a
>
> frictional process
>
> with
> the
>
> electrical output
>
> resulting from the
> steam
> friction
> passing
>
> through the
>
> nozzles.   After
>
> reading an old
> (1920
> s)
> Thermodynamics
> in
> Chemistry text
> book I
> realized
> that
> the
> phase change
> of
> materials was
> an
> electrical
>
> phenomenon and
> not purely
>
> mechanical.
>
> The atoms
> of the
> material
> lose
> or
> gain
>
> electrons in the
>
> process which
>
> accounts for the
> discrepancy
> in the
> energy
>
> equation when a
>
> material
> transitions
>
> between phases.
>
> More energy
> is
> present after
> the phase
> change
> back to the
> lower
> form or
> atomic
> state. The
> text book
> stated
> that this
>
> phenomenon could
> not
> be
> explained.
>
> When Jerry
> and I
> attended a
>
> Conference hosted
>
> by
> Hal Puthoff
> down
> in Austin
> back
> about 6 years
> ago
> a
> Physicist
> from
> Austria
>
> presented a paper
> on the
> phase
>
> change
> of water and
> the
> attendant
>
> electrical
>
> phenomenon which
>
> is
> totally not
>
> understood by
> modern
> science.
>
> Now my
>
> suspicions
> were
>
> confirmed that
> phase
> changes of
>
> materials are an
> electrostatic
>
> phenomenon, which
> leads
> us to the
>
> fundamental
> question of,
>
> What is
>
> heat?    We
> were
> told in the
>
> school
> that heat is
> the
> presence of
> energy
> and cool is
> the
> absence
> of energy.
>
> What is the
> form
> of this
>
> energy?  Let
> us
> look at
> a
> very simple
>
> example of heating
> which
> may explain
>
> this
> process.
>
> When
>
> sunlight strikes
> an
> absorbing
>
> surface it is
> heated
>
> because electrons
> in the
> material
> are
> converted to
> photons which
> are
> emitted in the
>
> infrared band of
>
> light
> leaving the
>
> material in a net
>
> positive state or
>
> hot.  The
> more
>
> electrons a
>
> material loses the
> hotter
> it becomes.
>
> Now
> the inverse
>
> situation is
>
> explored by
>
> evaporating some
>
> water
> from the
>
> surface of a
>
> material which
> leaves
> the surface
> in
> a
> net negative
> state
> or cold.
>
> Heat or
> cold
> is based on
>
> the
> ion
>
> relationship in
> the
> material.
>
> When we
> apply
> a flame
> (ionizing) to
> a
> material we
> cause
> the emission
> of
> photons
> which is
>
> basically
>
> stripping away
>
> electrons from the
>
> atomic
> structure
>
> causing a gross
> net
> positive
>
> situation to
>
> occur.
> Now we are
>
> getting a picture
> as to
> how an
>
> electric current
> across the
>
> Peltier junction
> can
> transport
>
> thermal energy
> (ions).
>
> Since the
> energy
> is in the
> form
> of presence
>
> or
> absence of
>
> electrons then it
> is a
> simple
>
> explanation as to
> how the
>
> process works.
>
> All phase
> change
> processes
> work
> the
> same way
>
> basically via ion
>
> transport and are
> not
> mechanical
> processes
> which
> we were
>
> taught.  Everything
>
> in
>
> chemistry is
> an electrical
> or
> electrostatic
>
> process at the
> atomic
> level
> based on the
>
> ionized state of
> the
> atoms
>
> involved.
> At a Vanguard
>
> Science Roundtable
>
> discussion several
> years
> ago
> we talked
> about
> the ion wind
> method
> of fire
>
> fighting in
> which ionized
> air
> will
>
> extinguish a flame
>
> because of the
> cooling
>
> effects.  Now
> we see
> Patents
> issued
> based on
> negative ion
>
> spraying of a
>
> surface causing it
> to
> rapidly
> cool because
> it
> becomes net
>
> negative charged.
>
> This is a
> very
>
> efficient method
> of
>
> air-conditioning
>
> because an ion
> generator
> operates
> at very
> high
> voltages with
> very
> little
>
>
> current
>
> involved.
>
> It is
>
> possible to
>
> develop this ion
> transport
>
> (thermal energy)
> to
> provide direct
>
> electrical
> output from
> very
> subtle
>
> temperature
>
> differentials.
>
> Remember
> that this is
> a
> direct
>
> reversible process
> where
> a thermal
> differential
> will
> cause a
>
> development of
>
> current and
>
> voltage
> as in the
>
> Peltier device.
>
> I hope that
> this
> dialog will
> provide some
> food
> for thought
> out
> there on the
> Keely
> Net.
> Please
>
> provide some
>
> feedback on this
> very
> interesting
>
> line
> of
>
> experimentation.
>
> Norm
>
>
>
>
> On
>
> 7/7/2018 5:38 PM,
> [email protected]
> [EVGRAY] wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Norm,
>
>
>
>
> Part of
>
> your heat
>
> treatise was
>
> evaporated by
>
> yahoo, feel
>
> free to send
> to
> my email,
>
> very
>
> interesting
>
> topic that
>
> bummed me out
>
> when I hit
>
> "Would" and
>
> nothing
>
> further!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> In
>
> respect to my
>
> wireless
>
> energy
>
> experiment I
>
> have found PNP
> to
> be superior
> to
> NPN, maybe
>
> they shut off
>
> faster being
>
> always on or
>
> maybe the end
>
> result is more
>
> hole ish.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> #yiv7877672524 #yiv7877672524 --
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>

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vantablack    This coating achieves the 
highest absorptivity of all!


On 7/10/2018 7:24 AM, Norman Wootan wrote:
>
> https://www.alibaba.com/showroom/peltier-chip.html Thay, I have had an 
> account with Alibaba for many years and have ordered sample quantities 
> of items from them. I really don"t know what the difference is between 
> the refrigeration and generator chips. May be something in the 
> semi-conductor material used.   Alibaba is the cheapest source of the 
> Peltier Junctions that I have found.  I got a ton of the Marlow Ind. 
> chips via salvage of Medical equipment and main frame computer 
> systems. Regarding the black body solar panels, please go back and 
> read the various articles that I have posed on my research. Recent 
> break through on black body technology is fantastic.   The latest from 
> Industry is a total efficiency of greater than 99 percent absorptive!  
> Thay!  do your homework and read all the references to get the whole 
> picture!
>
> https://www.aremco.com/news-item/new-hie-coat-840-c-high-temp-black-body-coating-offered/
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_body
>
> Long, long ago I read an interesting article regarding the behavior of 
> infrared radiation and quickly picked up on the fact that photons in 
> the infrared / far-infrared region of light cannot penetrate a 
> collector glazing at acute angles. 45 degrees or less.  A black body 
> surface is a near perfect receptor as well as a near perfect emmiter 
> of photons.  Proof of this is the fact that you can make ice on a 
> clear sky over desert with a black body emmiter. The radiation into 
> space of the IR band photons leave the surface in a gross negative 
> state thereby creating temperatures below freezing. (Read my article 
> What is Heat) The secret is in ionization phenomenon.  Now let's look 
> at the powerful ionization rays of full spectrum sun light. When the 
> sunlight penetrates the glazing of your solar collector and strikes 
> your black body receptor surface ,said surface becomes ionized gross 
> positive due to photon re-emmision in the far infrared and infrared 
> spectrum. The preponderance of this re-emmision from the black body 
> surface is at 90 degrees to the surface. Hmmm.   Now understanding 
> that the infrared spectrum cannot penetrate the glazing (re-emmision, 
> you just make your collector surface into 90 degree trouths (  so that 
> re-emmission is at a 45 degree angle to underside glazing angle of 
> incidence.  A quarter silvered tempered glazing is real important 
> here.  The collector is super efficient when you encase the whole 
> thing in thermal foam to prevent heat losses due to overall collector 
> heating. The unit that I built was a zeolyte based collector and the 
> super thermal efficient design sent the operating temperatures over 
> 200 degrees and shattered the glazing. The collector back plane was 
> made from a 4ft. X 8ft. sheet of mild steel bent in a metal break with 
> 8 inch wide 90 degree troughs which gave me a IR re-emmision angle of 
> incidence of 45 degrees (perponderence)  You have now cut your losses 
> of energy to the lowest possible.  The application of the Peltier chip 
> coating (array) to the front side and circulating cooling water or air 
> to the backside of collector plane will give you more than 100 degree 
> thermal differential across the chips thus yielding a very efficient 
> overall collector. 10X greater output over photovoltaic collectors.  
> Sure the cost is much greater but good investment. See: 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_internal_reflection
> https://physics.ucf.edu/~rep/publications/JournalPubs2010/ClearyGrating2010.pdf
>
> On 1/16/2016 10:06 AM, Norman wrote:
>
> PS:
>
> Natural infrared
>
> Sunlight, at an effective temperature of 5,780 kelvins, is composed of 
> nearly thermal-spectrum radiation that is slightly more than half 
> infrared. At zenith, sunlight provides an irradiance 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irradiance>of just over 1 kilowatt 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilowatt>per square meter at sea level. 
> Of this energy, 527 watts is infrared radiation, 445 watts is visible 
> light <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visible_light>, and 32 watts is 
> ultraviolet <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet>radiation.^[10] 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared#cite_note-10>
>
> On the surface of Earth, at far lower temperatures than the surface of 
> the Sun, almost all thermal radiation consists of infrared in various 
> wavelengths. Of these natural thermal radiation processes only 
> lightning and natural fires are hot enough to produce much visible 
> energy, and fires produce far more infrared than visible-light energy.
> If you are going to collect it you have to know what you are dealing with!
>
> On 1/16/2016 10:01 AM, Norman wrote:
>
> Back in the "day" 1996 when we were doing the "Elemental Replication/ 
> "holy water" experiments, the two Texas Instruments Chemist present 
> told of how they created a "black-body absorber" by acid etch burning 
> of hard chrome that produced a "blackest black" that you will ever 
> see. Totally absorbed all light with no re-emission at all.  This 
> really "intrigued me for I was designing a very special "flat plate" 
> solar collector, the design of which no one had thought of!  The 
> design of a collector that has "zero" re-emission means that you 
> capture all of the solar influx energy with practically no loss back 
> to the atmosphere other than the modest heating of the surrounding 
> housing material.   If you are interested in the possibility of a 
> Peltier Junction Collector, it is wise to read the following document. 
> http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy02osti/31267.pdf
> There are other "tricks of the trade" which most "solar guys" are not 
> aware of.
> Of course you cannot even think of designing "the perfect collector" 
> without reading and totally understanding the subject of absorption/ 
> re-emission.  Best start is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared
> "Enjoy"!    Norm
>
> On 1/15/2016 1:46 PM, Norman wrote:
>
> Moray!  Here is a rundown on the use of the Peltier Junction Chips 
> from back in the 60s. See; 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Dynamics_Electric_Boatwhere 
> large 8 ton capable solid state cooling  (very compact) units were 
> used on all the nuclear submarines since they had plenty of power 
> available and these units took up very little room. ( I have numerous 
> photos)  Second generation computers and electronics used them for the 
> obvious reasons due to compactness.  Salvaging out of this old 
> technology was done to recover the tons of 6061 extruded cooling and 
> heating finned sinks. The Peltier chips went into a  bin where I got 
> thousands of them for the taking.  I sold them for a buck apiece to my 
> friend at B.G. Micro here in Dallas for he had customers waiting to 
> get there hands on them. The wholesale price to Industry was at the 
> time about $7.00 for the large 3 sq inch chip. The small chips were 
> about $5.00.  If the Electric Boat Engineers had known about the 
> "reverse" process, they would have bonded via heat sinking putty the 
> array of chips directly to the "cold" outer hull of the submarines and 
> supplied a volume of steam to the hot side to deliver a tremendous 
> amount of electric power from the vast area of the metal hull. "Just 
> saying"!  Lol   To answer your question, since there is  such a 
> tremendous output/ sq. meter the Peltier solar panels would be well 
> worth the investment. There are many ways to get the needed "heat 
> differential" of which I can see your "brain massaging  as I write 
> this"! Since the chip construction is mostly ceramic & metal alloy 
> construction, they can take a heat input much greater than I used and 
> would give many times the power output.  I can envision the 
> development of a panel of similar dimensions as the solar panel with a 
> continuous laminated membrane of the required semiconductor component 
> to provide approximately 10 kw from 1X2 meter surface collector 
> operating at 180 degrees under the glazing glass.   Ground cool sinks 
> could provide the cooling water at near ambient temperatures!   "Dead 
> Nuts" simple!     Norm
> Roughly figuring, even using the Marlow Peltier large chips @ 3 sq, 
> in. (1550 sq, in. / meter sq.)  = 516 chips x $5 = $2583 for a yield 
> of greater than 655 watts/ meter sq.  Ain't shabby!
>
> On 1/14/2016 9:59 PM, Mbking42 wrote:
>
> Norm,
>
> That is creative! A Peltier junction solar heat to electricity converter.
> How cheap can an array of such junctions be made? Would it be 
> significantly cheaper than today's solar panels?
> Good idea, Norm!
>
> -Moray
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Norman <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> To: Mbking42 <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; jongen422 
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; jerrrysmith 
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; jsstone05 
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> Cc: jdecker <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; 
> patrickgbailey <[email protected]> 
> <mailto:[email protected]>; mleclair 
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> Sent: Thu, Jan 14, 2016 8:38 am
> Subject: Re: Vortex cavitation energy
>
> Moray!  "total agreement" here!   Here is something to "ponder"! While 
> studying Victor Schauberger's Implosion Vortex which I incorporated 
> into my Patent of the Hydrogen Generator, I naturally had to 
> understand the complex Hilsch tube vortex generator and how through 
> "ion separation" at tremendous rotational velocities of over a million 
> rpm caused the more dense, negative ionized air to migrate to the core 
> discharge and exit as sub zero flow while the "positive ionized air 
> swirled with high heat gain and exit at the hot air discharge port 
> creating a mass flow proportion of 75% cold air discharge compared to 
> a 25% hot air discharge.   Heat differential ( this device) 40 degree 
> F. cold air vs 270 degree hot air discharge from an input  of 25 CFM @ 
> 100 PSI, 100 degree F. air.  Different devices produce much colder  
> and  greater differentials.  Now when you consider that a "plasmoid" 
> is a, "As you just pointed out",  "A poloidal rotation closing into a 
> toroidal rotation, a spiral closing on itself".   I perceive the 
> rapidly rotating plasma toroidal ball as a complex implosion vortex 
> (multiples) with a core of heavily "negative ionized particles" with 
> an outer mantle of highly ionized "positive" particles.  The infolding 
> super high speed rotation causes the "charge separation. The 
> "positive" outer mantle give the appearance of a "positive" event when 
> in reality the core is "Negative".  and more dense.  The implosion 
> vortex proves this to be true.
> Please give the following some thought!
> Back in the early 90s I wrote a small piece on my ideas as to "What is 
> Heat"???  I posted this to KeelNet with no response. Since I was doing 
> a lot of salvage work on 1st & 2nd generation computer equipment I was 
> able to accumulate hundreds of Peltier Cooling Chips which are 
> manufactured by Marlow Industries here in Dallas.  If you can provide 
> a DC current across this device and get "ion separation", a hot side 
> and a cold side. it would be 'logical" (as Spock would say) to assume 
> that a temperature differential across a junction device like this 
> will yield a DC current @ a given voltage i.e. wattage output.  BTW, 
> all of this was posted to the KeelyNet after I performed the 
> experiment with "no comments"!  I carefully set up a "hot" sink of 
> heated water pumped through a copper block (hot side) and a "cold"" 
> sink, with normal tap water flowing through a copper block on cold 
> side!   Here are the results of the Peltier Junction Chip output.
>
> Peltier Junction, small chip, 1.25" X 1.25" = 1.5625 sq."  I used 
> several different heat/cold differentials to provide a wattage output 
> graph.
>
> 116 F. -  65 F. =   51 F. differential =  .35 A  @   .63 VDC =  .22   
> watts
> 119 F. -  63 F. =   56 F. differential =  .40 A  @   .69 VDC =  .276 watts
> 158 F. -  63 F. =   95 F. differential =  .70 A  @ 1.21 VDC = .847 watts
> 163 F. -  62 F. =  101 F. differential = .80 A @  1.29 VDC = 1.03  watts
>
> Peltier Junction, large chip, 1.75" X 1.75" = 3.06 sq"
>
> 127 F. -  65 F. =    62 F. differential =   .80 A @   .62 VDC =   .496 
> watts
> 134 F. -  63 F. =    71 F. differential =   .90 A @   .70 VDC =   
> .63   watts
> 142 F. -  63  F. =   79 F. differential =   1.0 A @   .76 VDC =   
> .76   watts
> 150 F. -  63  F. =   87 F. differential =   1.2 A @   .86 VDC =   1.03 
> watts
> 157 F. -  62 F.  =   95 F. differential =  1.22 A @! .93 VDC =   1.13 
> watts
> 162 F. -  62 F.  =  100 F. differential = 1.35 A @ 1.0 VDC =    1.35 watts
>
> Now consider that the "accepted" solar heat influx, full daytime 
> sunlight is approximately one kilowatt / square meter.
> Photovoltaic solar collectors are just breaking the 10% efficiencies 
> of converting the solar input into electrical output which means that 
> they are achieving approximately 100 watts per square meter of 
> collector surface.
>
> From the above Pelteir Junction table you can do a quick calculation 
> and realize that the output is vastly superior to solar!
> The small chip puts out .659 watts / square inch X 1550 square inches 
> / square meter = 1021.765 watts / square meter @ 101 F. differential.
>
> The large chip puts out .44 watts / square inch @ a temperature 
> differential of 100 F. yielding (1550 square inches / square meter) 
> 683.8 watts / meter square.  Quite a difference compared to the 100 
> watts / square meter for solar collectors.    Any heat source with an 
> attendant cold sink can provide electric power  via Peltier Junction 
> far superior to solar cells.
>
> Flat plate collectors in direct sunlight can achieve collector 
> temperatures close to 180 F. so with a cold sink maintained by ambient 
> temp water you can greatly outperform standard solar collection 
> performance.     I think "Spock" would agree!
>
> My ideas as to just "What is Heat"!    Crude by thought provocative!   
> Norm
>
> What is Heat #2
>
> For about 10 years I have been studying the effects of
>
> heating and cooling associated with the phase change of
>
> liquids with the hope of building a simple generator of
>
> electrical power around the phenomenon.The reason for this
>
> interest is based on the theory that energy can be extracted
>
> from the ambient background via thermal differentials.My
>
> line of thinking really took off back when I experimented
>
> with the all too familiar Peltier junction devices found in
>
> electronic cooling devices.Would you believe that most
>
> people do not understand how these devices move thermal
>
> energy through a current flow across a semiconductor
>
> junction.Historically we find thatGerman physicist,
>
> Thomas Seebeck back in 1820 observed that when heat was
>
> applied to a junction of copper and steel wire that
>
> electrical energy resulted.Later in 1834 Jean Peltier
>
> discovered that when a direct current was applied to two
>
> dissimilar metals the junction got hot or cold.It was not
>
> until 1838 that Emil Lenz clearly showed the importance of
>
> both Seebeck and Peltier s discoveries by placing a drop of
>
> water on the junction of dissimilar metals which froze then
>
> melted when the polarity of the direct current was
>
> reversed.These discoveries remained dormant for over 100
>
> years because of the unavailability of semiconductor
>
> materials which could provide the wide temperature
>
> differentials.In the 1930 s semiconductor materials became
>
> available which revived the electric cooling principles.In
>
> the 1960 s many companies began building spot cooling
>
> devices and refrigerators based on these effects using a
>
> junction material of bismuth-telluride. Today more advanced
>
> materials are used with the basic parameters of being a pore
>
> thermal conductor but being an excellent electrical
>
> conductor. The dissimilar materials must provide a high
>
> coefficient of voltage temperature relationship.The first
>
> Peltier devices that I experimented with back about 10 years
>
> ago were built by Marlow Industries here in Dallas.With a
>
> small temperature differential across the device a weak
>
> current with an attendant voltage was developed.Increasing
>
> the differential provided a proportional increase in current
>
> and voltage.About 6 years ago I posted a chart of the
>
> wattage generated from two different size Peltier chips on
>
> the KeelyNet BBS.My curiosity was based on the puzzle of
>
> how electron flow could move thermal energy across the
>
> junctions and how electrical energy was produced by moving
>
> thermal energy across the junction.This is a directly
>
> reversible situation based on polarity.
>
> Now let us look at a very familiar parallel process used in
>
> refrigeration, cooling and heating devices employing phase
>
> change material such as water and refrigerants.We have
>
> always been led to believe that evaporating water provided
>
> cooling effects which is a mechanical process. By the same
>
> mechanical process we are provided heating effects by the
>
> condensation of a gas back to a liquid phase change.Would
>
> you believe that any material that undergoes a phase change
>
> provides an attendant electrical effect.Back in 1840
>
> Armstrong invented an electrostatic generator based on
>
> escaping steam through insulated nozzles which provided one
>
> of the most powerful devices of this type ever built.
>
> Popular belief was that this was a frictional process with
>
> the electrical output resulting from the steam friction
>
> passing through the nozzles.After reading an old (1920 s)
>
> Thermodynamics in Chemistry text book I realized that the
>
> phase change of materials was an electrical phenomenon and
>
> not purely mechanical.The atoms of the material lose or
>
> gain electrons in the process which accounts for the
>
> discrepancy in the energy equation when a material
>
> transitions between phases.More energy is present after
>
> the phase change back to the lower form or atomic state. The
>
> text book stated that this phenomenon could not be
>
> explained.When Jerry and I attended a Conference hosted by
>
> Hal Puthoff down in Austin back about 6 years ago a
>
> physicist from Austria presented a paper on the phase change
>
> of water and the attendant electrical phenomenon which is
>
> totally not understood by modern science.Now my suspicions
>
> were confirmed that phase changes of materials are an
>
> electrostatic phenomenon, which leads us to the fundamental
>
> question of,What is heat?We were told in theschool
>
> that heat is the presence of energy and cool is the absence
>
> of energy.What is the form of this energy?Let us look at
>
> a very simple example of heating which may explain this
>
> process.When sunlight strikes an absorbing surface it is
>
> heated because electrons in the material are converted to
>
> photons which are emitted in the infrared band of light
>
> leaving the material in a net positive state or hot.The
>
> more electrons a material looses the hotter it becomes.Now
>
> the inverse situation is explored by evaporating some water
>
> from the surface of a material which leaves the surface in a
>
> net negative state or cold.Heat or cold is based on the
>
> ion relationship in the material.When we apply a flame
>
> (ionizing) to a material we cause the emission of photons
>
> which is basically stripping away electrons from the atomic
>
> structure causing a gross net positive situation to occur.
>
> Now we are getting a picture as to how an electric current
>
> across the Peltier junction can transport thermal energy
>
> (ions).Since the energy is in the form of presence or
>
> absence of electrons then it is a simple explanation as to
>
> how the process works.All phase change processes work the
>
> same way basically via ion transport and are not mechanical
>
> processes which we were taught.Everythingin chemistry is
>
> an electrical or electrostatic process at the atomic level
>
> based on the ionized state of the atoms involved.
>
> At a Vanguard Science Roundtable discussion several years ago
>
> we talked about the ion wind method of fire fighting in
>
> which ionized air will extinguish a flame because of the
>
> cooling effects.Now we see Patents issued based on
>
> negative ion spraying of a surface causing it to rapidly
>
> cool because it becomes net negative charged.This is a
>
> very efficient method of air conditioning because an ion
>
> generator operates at very high voltages with very little
>
> current involved.It is possible to develop this ion
>
> transport (thermal energy) to provide direct electrical
>
> output from very subtle temperature differentials.Remember
>
> that this is a direct reversible process where a thermal
>
> differential will cause a development of current and voltage
>
> as in the Peltier device.I hope that this dialog will
>
> provide some food for thought out there on the KeelyNet.
>
> Please provide some feedback on this very interesting line
>
> of experimentation.Norm
>
>
> BTW, when the Patent Office started researching "Super Conductivity" 
> they ran right into Tesla's work with the idea of using the Linde, 
> liquid air process to provide a super conductive Tesla Coil primary.   
> Tesla understood the power of a "Cold Sink" with electron densities of 
> a very high order! "Hmmmmn"!
>
>
>
> On 7/10/2018 5:01 AM, Thaelin [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>
>> Hi Norm:
>> I have a few of these that were in the ice chests and such. You 
>> mention that some are coolers and others are generators. Can you 
>> elaborate on what the differences are? For someone out in the rough, 
>> a solar panel is a dead give away you are there. A black surface in 
>> the same area would be hard to notice if you were not really looking. 
>> This tech perks my interest for LV generation.
>>
>> thay
>>
>> --------------------------------------------
>> On Mon, 7/9/18, Norman Wootan [email protected] [EVGRAY] 
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [EVGRAY] General info!
>> To: [email protected]
>> Date: Monday, July 9, 2018, 2:26 PM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Warren, I put together a one square ft. laminated
>> panel that had
>> 100 Peltier chips that proved the concept and yes,
>> they do produce
>> 10X more output per square meter of collector surface
>> over the
>> photovoltaic collectors with just the differential of
>> 100 degrees
>> F. It would take a pilot program funded to make sheets
>> of these
>> junctions.  Dollars $$$$. Purchasing the Peltiers
>> from Alibaba,
>> China is the lowest prices I have found for the
>> Generator chips.
>> (bulk buy).   BTW! They do make both chips,
>> refrigeration and
>> generator versions.  Norm
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 7/8/2018 12:36 PM,
>> Warren Keillor
>> [email protected]
>> [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Norman
>> If
>> we can
>> make test units, it would be good.
>> Cheers
>> Warren
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent
>> from Yahoo Mail on Android
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 at 11:43 AM,
>> Norman Wootan
>> [email protected]
>> [EVGRAY]
>> <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I am searching my files as we
>> write
>> looking for Peltier tables of
>> output. If
>> sheets of bonded junctions
>> would be made,
>> this approach has 10X energy
>> output over
>> the photovoltaic approach per
>> square ft.
>> of space.  Uses only temp
>> differential
>> from the ambient
>> environment.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On
>> 7/8/2018 2:54 AM, Warren
>> Keillor [email protected]
>> [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Norman
>> You
>> have written the best
>> essay on this
>> subject I have ever
>> read.
>> What
>> an interesting concept,
>> well
>> researched.
>> By
>> carefully stating the
>> subject, you
>> also leave the door open
>> to further
>> research on a collective
>> basis, for
>> a group effort to build
>> practical
>> applications.
>> This
>> paper deserves
>> recognition in a
>> serious scientific
>> journal.
>> Cheers
>> Warren
>>
>> Sent
>> from
>> Yahoo Mail on
>> Android
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 7 Jul
>> 2018 at 8:56
>> PM, Norman Wootan
>> [email protected]
>> [EVGRAY]
>> <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Try
>> this one:
>>
>>
>>
>> What is
>> Heat
>> #3
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> For about 10
>> years
>> I have been
>>
>> studying the
>>
>> effects of
>> heating and
>>
>> cooling associated
>> with
>> the phase
>> change
>> of
>> liquids with
>> the
>> hope of
>>
>> building a simple
>>
>> generator of
>> electrical
>> power
>> around the
>>
>> phenomenon.
>>
>> The reason
>> for
>> this
>> interest is
>> based
>> on the
>> theory
>> that energy
>> can be
>> extracted
>> from the
>>
>> ambient background
>> via
>> thermal
>>
>> differentials.
>>
>> My
>> line of
>>
>> thinking really
>> took
>> off back when
>> I
>> experimented
>> with the all
>> too
>> familiar
>>
>> Peltier junction
>>
>> devices found in
>> electronic
>>
>> cooling devices.
>>
>> Would you
>>
>> believe that most
>> people do not
>>
>> understand how
>> these
>> devices move
>>
>> thermal
>> energy
>>
>> through a current
>> flow
>> across a
>>
>> semiconductor
>> junction.
>>
>> Historically
>> we
>> find that
>> German
>> physicist,
>> Thomas
>>
>> Seebeck back in
>> 1820
>> observed that
>> when
>> heat was
>> applied to a
>>
>> junction of copper
>> and
>> steel wire
>>
>> that
>> electrical
>> energy
>> resulted.
>>
>> Later in
>> 1834
>> Jean Peltier
>> discovered
>> that
>> when a direct
>>
>> current was
>>
>> applied to two
>> Dissimilar
>> metals
>> the
>>
>> junction got hot
>> or
>> cold.  It
>> was
>> not
>> Until 1838
>> that
>> Emil Lenz
>>
>> clearly showed the
>>
>> importance of
>> Both Seebeck
>> and
>> Peltier s
>>
>> discoveries by
>>
>> placing a drop of
>> Water on the
>>
>> junction of
>>
>> dissimilar metals
>> which
>> froze then
>> Melted when
>> the
>> polarity of
>> the
>> direct current
>>
>> was
>> Reversed.
>>
>> These
>>
>> discoveries
>>
>> remained dormant
>> for
>> over 100
>> Years because
>> of the
>>
>> unavailability of
>>
>> semiconductor
>> Materials
>> which
>> could
>>
>> provide the wide
>>
>> temperature
>> Differentials.
>>
>> In the 1930
>> s
>> semiconductor
>>
>> materials became
>> Available
>> which
>> revived the
>>
>> electric cooling
>>
>> principles.
>>
>> In
>> The 1960 s
>> many
>> companies
>> began
>> building
>> spot
>> cooling
>> Devices and
>>
>> refrigerators
>> based
>> on these
>>
>> effects using a
>> Junction
>>
>> material of
>>
>> bismuth-telluride.
>> Today
>> more
>>
>> advanced
>> Materials are
>> used
>> with the
>> basic
>> parameters
>> of
>> being a pore
>> Thermal
>>
>> conductor but
>> being
>> an excellent
>>
>> electrical
>> Conductor.
>> The
>> dissimilar
>>
>> materials must
>>
>> provide a high
>> Coefficient
>> of
>> voltage
>>
>> temperature
>>
>> relationship.
>>
>> The first
>> Peltier
>>
>> devices that I
>>
>> experimented with
>> back
>> about 10
>>
>> years
>> ago were
>> built
>> by Marlow
>>
>> Industries here in
>>
>> Dallas.   With
>>
>> a
>> small
>>
>> temperature
>>
>> differential
>> across
>> the device
>> a
>> weak
>> current with
>> an
>> attendant
>>
>> voltage was
>>
>> developed.
>>
>> Increasing
>> the
>>
>> differential
>>
>> provided a
>>
>> proportional
>>
>> increase in
>>
>> current
>> and voltage.
>>
>> About 6
>> years
>> ago I posted
>> a
>> chart of the
>> wattage
>>
>> generated from two
>>
>> different size
>>
>> Peltier chips on
>> the Keely Net
>>
>> BBS.   My
>>
>> curiosity was
>> based
>> on the
>> puzzle
>> of
>> how electron
>> flow
>> could move
>>
>> thermal energy
>> across
>> the
>> junctions and
>> how
>> electrical
>> energy
>> was
>>
>> produced by moving
>> thermal
>> energy
>> across the
>>
>> junction.  This
>> is a
>> directly
>> reversible
>>
>> situation based on
>>
>> polarity.
>> Now let us
>> look
>> at a very
>>
>> familiar parallel
>>
>> process used in
>> refrigeration,
>>
>> cooling and
>>
>> heating devices
>>
>> employing phase
>> change
>>
>> material such as
>> water
>> and
>>
>> refrigerants.
>>
>> We have
>> always been
>> led to
>> believe
>> that
>> evaporating
>> water
>> provided
>> cooling
>>
>> effects which is a
>>
>> mechanical
>>
>> process. By the
>>
>> same
>> mechanical
>>
>> process we are
>>
>> provided heating
>>
>> effects by the
>> condensation
>> of a
>> gas back to a
>> liquid
>> phase
>>
>> change.  Would
>>
>> you believe
>> that
>> any material
>> that
>> undergoes a
>> phase
>> change
>> provides an
>>
>> attendant
>>
>> electrical effect.
>>
>> Back in
>>
>> 1840
>> Armstrong
>>
>> invented an
>>
>> electrostatic
>>
>> generator based on
>> escaping
>> steam
>> through
>>
>> insulated nozzles
>> which
>> provided one
>> of the most
>>
>> powerful devices
>> of
>> this type ever
>>
>> built.
>> Popular
>> belief
>> was that
>> this
>> was a
>>
>> frictional process
>>
>> with
>> the
>>
>> electrical output
>>
>> resulting from the
>> steam
>> friction
>> passing
>>
>> through the
>>
>> nozzles.   After
>>
>> reading an old
>> (1920
>> s)
>> Thermodynamics
>> in
>> Chemistry text
>> book I
>> realized
>> that
>> the
>> phase change
>> of
>> materials was
>> an
>> electrical
>>
>> phenomenon and
>> not purely
>>
>> mechanical.
>>
>> The atoms
>> of the
>> material
>> lose
>> or
>> gain
>>
>> electrons in the
>>
>> process which
>>
>> accounts for the
>> discrepancy
>> in the
>> energy
>>
>> equation when a
>>
>> material
>> transitions
>>
>> between phases.
>>
>> More energy
>> is
>> present after
>> the phase
>> change
>> back to the
>> lower
>> form or
>> atomic
>> state. The
>> text book
>> stated
>> that this
>>
>> phenomenon could
>> not
>> be
>> explained.
>>
>> When Jerry
>> and I
>> attended a
>>
>> Conference hosted
>>
>> by
>> Hal Puthoff
>> down
>> in Austin
>> back
>> about 6 years
>> ago
>> a
>> Physicist
>> from
>> Austria
>>
>> presented a paper
>> on the
>> phase
>>
>> change
>> of water and
>> the
>> attendant
>>
>> electrical
>>
>> phenomenon which
>>
>> is
>> totally not
>>
>> understood by
>> modern
>> science.
>>
>> Now my
>>
>> suspicions
>> were
>>
>> confirmed that
>> phase
>> changes of
>>
>> materials are an
>> electrostatic
>>
>> phenomenon, which
>> leads
>> us to the
>>
>> fundamental
>> question of,
>>
>> What is
>>
>> heat?    We
>> were
>> told in the
>>
>> school
>> that heat is
>> the
>> presence of
>> energy
>> and cool is
>> the
>> absence
>> of energy.
>>
>> What is the
>> form
>> of this
>>
>> energy?  Let
>> us
>> look at
>> a
>> very simple
>>
>> example of heating
>> which
>> may explain
>>
>> this
>> process.
>>
>> When
>>
>> sunlight strikes
>> an
>> absorbing
>>
>> surface it is
>> heated
>>
>> because electrons
>> in the
>> material
>> are
>> converted to
>> photons which
>> are
>> emitted in the
>>
>> infrared band of
>>
>> light
>> leaving the
>>
>> material in a net
>>
>> positive state or
>>
>> hot.  The
>> more
>>
>> electrons a
>>
>> material loses the
>> hotter
>> it becomes.
>>
>> Now
>> the inverse
>>
>> situation is
>>
>> explored by
>>
>> evaporating some
>>
>> water
>> from the
>>
>> surface of a
>>
>> material which
>> leaves
>> the surface
>> in
>> a
>> net negative
>> state
>> or cold.
>>
>> Heat or
>> cold
>> is based on
>>
>> the
>> ion
>>
>> relationship in
>> the
>> material.
>>
>> When we
>> apply
>> a flame
>> (ionizing) to
>> a
>> material we
>> cause
>> the emission
>> of
>> photons
>> which is
>>
>> basically
>>
>> stripping away
>>
>> electrons from the
>>
>> atomic
>> structure
>>
>> causing a gross
>> net
>> positive
>>
>> situation to
>>
>> occur.
>> Now we are
>>
>> getting a picture
>> as to
>> how an
>>
>> electric current
>> across the
>>
>> Peltier junction
>> can
>> transport
>>
>> thermal energy
>> (ions).
>>
>> Since the
>> energy
>> is in the
>> form
>> of presence
>>
>> or
>> absence of
>>
>> electrons then it
>> is a
>> simple
>>
>> explanation as to
>> how the
>>
>> process works.
>>
>> All phase
>> change
>> processes
>> work
>> the
>> same way
>>
>> basically via ion
>>
>> transport and are
>> not
>> mechanical
>> processes
>> which
>> we were
>>
>> taught.  Everything
>>
>> in
>>
>> chemistry is
>> an electrical
>> or
>> electrostatic
>>
>> process at the
>> atomic
>> level
>> based on the
>>
>> ionized state of
>> the
>> atoms
>>
>> involved.
>> At a Vanguard
>>
>> Science Roundtable
>>
>> discussion several
>> years
>> ago
>> we talked
>> about
>> the ion wind
>> method
>> of fire
>>
>> fighting in
>> which ionized
>> air
>> will
>>
>> extinguish a flame
>>
>> because of the
>> cooling
>>
>> effects.  Now
>> we see
>> Patents
>> issued
>> based on
>> negative ion
>>
>> spraying of a
>>
>> surface causing it
>> to
>> rapidly
>> cool because
>> it
>> becomes net
>>
>> negative charged.
>>
>> This is a
>> very
>>
>> efficient method
>> of
>>
>> air-conditioning
>>
>> because an ion
>> generator
>> operates
>> at very
>> high
>> voltages with
>> very
>> little
>>
>>
>> current
>>
>> involved.
>>
>> It is
>>
>> possible to
>>
>> develop this ion
>> transport
>>
>> (thermal energy)
>> to
>> provide direct
>>
>> electrical
>> output from
>> very
>> subtle
>>
>> temperature
>>
>> differentials.
>>
>> Remember
>> that this is
>> a
>> direct
>>
>> reversible process
>> where
>> a thermal
>> differential
>> will
>> cause a
>>
>> development of
>>
>> current and
>>
>> voltage
>> as in the
>>
>> Peltier device.
>>
>> I hope that
>> this
>> dialog will
>> provide some
>> food
>> for thought
>> out
>> there on the
>> Keely
>> Net.
>> Please
>>
>> provide some
>>
>> feedback on this
>> very
>> interesting
>>
>> line
>> of
>>
>> experimentation.
>>
>> Norm
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On
>>
>> 7/7/2018 5:38 PM,
>> [email protected]
>> [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Norm,
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Part of
>>
>> your heat
>>
>> treatise was
>>
>> evaporated by
>>
>> yahoo, feel
>>
>> free to send
>> to
>> my email,
>>
>> very
>>
>> interesting
>>
>> topic that
>>
>> bummed me out
>>
>> when I hit
>>
>> "Would" and
>>
>> nothing
>>
>> further!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> In
>>
>> respect to my
>>
>> wireless
>>
>> energy
>>
>> experiment I
>>
>> have found PNP
>> to
>> be superior
>> to
>> NPN, maybe
>>
>> they shut off
>>
>> faster being
>>
>> always on or
>>
>> maybe the end
>>
>> result is more
>>
>> hole ish.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> #yiv7877672524 #yiv7877672524 --
>> #yiv7877672524ygrp-mkp {
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>> 
>

Hi Norm:
   I have a few of these that were in the ice chests and such. You mention that some are coolers and others are generators. Can you elaborate on what the differences are? For someone out in the rough, a solar panel is a dead give away you are there. A black surface in the same area would be hard to notice if you were not really looking. This tech perks my interest for LV generation.

thay

--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 7/9/18, Norman Wootan [email protected] [EVGRAY] <[email protected]> wrote:

 Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [EVGRAY] General info!
 To: [email protected]
 Date: Monday, July 9, 2018, 2:26 PM
 
 
  
 
 
 
   
 
 
     
       
       
       
   
   
     Warren, I put together a one square ft. laminated
 panel that had
       100 Peltier chips that proved the concept and yes,
 they do produce
       10X more output per square meter of collector surface
 over the
       photovoltaic collectors with just the differential of
 100 degrees
       F. It would take a pilot program funded to make sheets
 of these
       junctions.  Dollars $$$$. Purchasing the Peltiers
 from Alibaba,
       China is the lowest prices I have found for the
 Generator chips.
       (bulk buy).   BTW! They do make both chips,
 refrigeration and
       generator versions.  Norm
 
     
     
 
     On 7/8/2018 12:36 PM,
 Warren Keillor
       [email protected]
 [EVGRAY] wrote:
 
     
     
       
        
       
           
             Norman
             If
 we can
               make test units, it would be good.
             Cheers
               Warren
 
               
 
               Sent
 from Yahoo Mail on Android
               
 
               
                 
                   On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 at 11:43 AM,
 Norman Wootan
                     [email protected]
 [EVGRAY]
                   <[email protected]>
 wrote:
                 
                 
                   
                     
                        
                       
                         
                           
                              
                             I am searching my files as we
 write
                               looking for Peltier tables of
 output. If
                               sheets of bonded junctions
 would be made,
                               this approach has 10X energy
 output over
                               the photovoltaic approach per
 square ft.
                               of space.  Uses only temp
 differential
                               from the ambient
 environment.
 
                             
                             
 
                             
                               On
                                 7/8/2018 2:54 AM, Warren
 Keillor [email protected]
                                 [EVGRAY] wrote:
 
                               
                               
  
                                 
                                   
 
                                     Norman
                                   You
                                     have written the best
 essay on this
                                     subject I have ever
 read.
                                   What
                                     an interesting concept,
 well
                                     researched.
                                   By
                                     carefully stating the
 subject, you
                                     also leave the door open
 to further
                                     research on a collective
 basis, for
                                     a group effort to build
 practical
                                     applications.
                                   This
                                     paper deserves
 recognition in a
                                     serious scientific
 journal.
                                   Cheers
                                     Warren
 
                                     Sent
 from
                                         Yahoo Mail on
 Android
                                     
 
                                     
                                       
                                         On Sat, 7 Jul
 2018 at 8:56
                                           PM, Norman Wootan
 [email protected]
                                           [EVGRAY]
                                         <[email protected]>
                                           wrote:
                                       
                                       
                                         
                                           
  
                                             
                                               
                                                 
                                                    
                                                   Try
 this one:
                                                    
                                                                       
                                                      
 What is
                                                       Heat
 #3
                                                    
                                                    
                                                    
                                                    
                                                   For about 10
                                                       years
 I have been
                                                      
 studying the
                                                      
 effects of
                                                   heating and
                                                      
 cooling associated
                                                       with
 the phase
                                                       change
 of
                                                   liquids with
                                                       the
 hope of
                                                      
 building a simple
                                                      
 generator of
                                                   electrical
                                                       power
 around the
                                                      
 phenomenon. 
                                                      
 The reason
                                                       for
 this
                                                   interest is
                                                       based
 on the
                                                       theory
 that energy
                                                       can be
 extracted
                                                   from the
                                                      
 ambient background
                                                       via
 thermal
                                                      
 differentials. 
                                                      
 My
                                                   line of
                                                      
 thinking really
                                                       took
 off back when
                                                       I
 experimented
                                                   with the all
                                                       too
 familiar
                                                      
 Peltier junction
                                                      
 devices found in
                                                   electronic
                                                      
 cooling devices. 
                                                      
 Would you
                                                      
 believe that most
                                                   people do not
                                                      
 understand how
                                                       these
 devices move
                                                      
 thermal
                                                   energy
                                                      
 through a current
                                                       flow
 across a
                                                      
 semiconductor
                                                   junction. 
                                                      
 Historically
                                                       we
 find that
                                                       German
 physicist,
                                                   Thomas
                                                      
 Seebeck back in
                                                       1820
 observed that
                                                       when
 heat was
                                                   applied to a
                                                      
 junction of copper
                                                       and
 steel wire
                                                      
 that
                                                   electrical
                                                       energy
 resulted. 
                                                      
 Later in
                                                       1834
 Jean Peltier
                                                   discovered
                                                       that
 when a direct
                                                      
 current was
                                                      
 applied to two
                                                   Dissimilar
                                                       metals
 the
                                                      
 junction got hot
                                                       or
 cold.  It
                                                       was
 not
                                                   Until 1838
                                                       that
 Emil Lenz
                                                      
 clearly showed the
                                                      
 importance of
                                                   Both Seebeck
                                                       and
 Peltier s
                                                      
 discoveries by
                                                      
 placing a drop of
                                                   Water on the
                                                      
 junction of
                                                      
 dissimilar metals
                                                       which
 froze then
                                                   Melted when
                                                       the
 polarity of
                                                       the
 direct current
                                                      
 was
                                                   Reversed. 
                                                      
 These
                                                      
 discoveries
                                                      
 remained dormant
                                                       for
 over 100
                                                   Years because
                                                       of the
                                                      
 unavailability of
                                                      
 semiconductor
                                                   Materials
                                                       which
 could
                                                      
 provide the wide
                                                      
 temperature
                                                   Differentials. 
                                                      
 In the 1930
                                                       s
 semiconductor
                                                      
 materials became
                                                   Available
                                                       which
 revived the
                                                      
 electric cooling
                                                      
 principles. 
                                                      
 In
                                                   The 1960 s
                                                       many
 companies
                                                       began
 building
                                                       spot
 cooling
                                                   Devices and
                                                      
 refrigerators
                                                       based
 on these
                                                      
 effects using a
                                                   Junction
                                                      
 material of
                                                      
 bismuth-telluride.
                                                       Today
 more
                                                      
 advanced
                                                   Materials are
                                                       used
 with the
                                                       basic
 parameters
                                                       of
 being a pore
                                                   Thermal
                                                      
 conductor but
                                                       being
 an excellent
                                                      
 electrical
                                                   Conductor.
                                                       The
 dissimilar
                                                      
 materials must
                                                      
 provide a high
                                                   Coefficient
                                                       of
 voltage
                                                      
 temperature
                                                      
 relationship. 
                                                      
 The first
                                                   Peltier
                                                      
 devices that I
                                                      
 experimented with
                                                       back
 about 10
                                                      
 years
                                                   ago were
                                                       built
 by Marlow
                                                      
 Industries here in
                                                      
 Dallas.   With
                                                      
 a
                                                   small
                                                      
 temperature
                                                      
 differential
                                                       across
 the device
                                                       a
 weak
                                                   current with
                                                       an
 attendant
                                                      
 voltage was
                                                      
 developed. 
                                                      
 Increasing
                                                   the
                                                      
 differential
                                                      
 provided a
                                                      
 proportional
                                                      
 increase in
                                                      
 current
                                                   and voltage. 
                                                      
 About 6
                                                       years
 ago I posted
                                                       a
 chart of the
                                                   wattage
                                                      
 generated from two
                                                      
 different size
                                                      
 Peltier chips on
                                                   the Keely Net
                                                      
 BBS.   My
                                                      
 curiosity was
                                                       based
 on the
                                                       puzzle
 of
                                                   how electron
                                                       flow
 could move
                                                      
 thermal energy
                                                       across
 the
                                                   junctions and
                                                       how
 electrical
                                                       energy
 was
                                                      
 produced by moving
                                                   thermal
                                                       energy
 across the
                                                      
 junction.  This
                                                       is a
 directly
                                                   reversible
                                                      
 situation based on
                                                      
 polarity.
                                                   Now let us
                                                       look
 at a very
                                                      
 familiar parallel
                                                      
 process used in
                                                   refrigeration,
                                                      
 cooling and
                                                      
 heating devices
                                                      
 employing phase
                                                   change
                                                      
 material such as
                                                       water
 and
                                                      
 refrigerants. 
                                                      
 We have
                                                   always been
                                                       led to
 believe
                                                       that
 evaporating
                                                       water
 provided
                                                   cooling
                                                      
 effects which is a
                                                      
 mechanical
                                                      
 process. By the
                                                      
 same
                                                   mechanical
                                                      
 process we are
                                                      
 provided heating
                                                      
 effects by the
                                                   condensation
                                                       of a
 gas back to a
                                                       liquid
 phase
                                                      
 change.  Would
                                                   
                                                   you believe
                                                       that
 any material
                                                       that
 undergoes a
                                                       phase
 change
                                                   provides an
                                                      
 attendant
                                                      
 electrical effect.  
                                                      
 Back in
                                                      
 1840
                                                   Armstrong
                                                      
 invented an
                                                      
 electrostatic
                                                      
 generator based on
                                                   escaping
                                                       steam
 through
                                                      
 insulated nozzles
                                                       which
 provided one
                                                   of the most
                                                      
 powerful devices
                                                       of
 this type ever
                                                      
 built.
                                                   Popular
                                                       belief
 was that
                                                       this
 was a
                                                      
 frictional process
                                                      
 with
                                                   the
                                                      
 electrical output
                                                      
 resulting from the
                                                       steam
 friction
                                                   passing
                                                      
 through the
                                                      
 nozzles.   After
                                                      
 reading an old
                                                       (1920
 s)
                                                   Thermodynamics
                                                       in
 Chemistry text
                                                       book I
 realized
                                                       that
 the
                                                   phase change
                                                       of
 materials was
                                                       an
 electrical
                                                      
 phenomenon and
                                                   not purely
                                                      
 mechanical. 
                                                      
 The atoms
                                                       of the
 material
                                                       lose
 or
                                                   gain
                                                      
 electrons in the
                                                      
 process which
                                                      
 accounts for the
                                                   discrepancy
                                                       in the
 energy
                                                      
 equation when a
                                                      
 material
                                                   transitions
                                                      
 between phases. 
                                                      
 More energy
                                                       is
 present after
                                                   the phase
                                                       change
 back to the
                                                       lower
 form or
                                                       atomic
 state. The
                                                   text book
                                                       stated
 that this
                                                      
 phenomenon could
                                                       not
 be
                                                   explained. 
                                                      
 When Jerry
                                                       and I
 attended a
                                                      
 Conference hosted
                                                      
 by
                                                   Hal Puthoff
                                                       down
 in Austin
                                                       back
 about 6 years
                                                       ago
 a
                                                   Physicist
                                                       from
 Austria
                                                      
 presented a paper
                                                       on the
 phase
                                                      
 change
                                                   of water and
                                                       the
 attendant
                                                      
 electrical
                                                      
 phenomenon which
                                                      
 is
                                                   totally not
                                                      
 understood by
                                                       modern
 science. 
                                                      
 Now my
                                                      
 suspicions
                                                   were
                                                      
 confirmed that
                                                       phase
 changes of
                                                      
 materials are an
                                                   electrostatic
                                                      
 phenomenon, which
                                                       leads
 us to the
                                                      
 fundamental
                                                   question of, 
                                                      
 What is
                                                      
 heat?    We
                                                       were
 told in the 
                                                      
 school 
                                                   that heat is
                                                       the
 presence of
                                                       energy
 and cool is
                                                       the
 absence
                                                   of energy. 
                                                      
 What is the
                                                       form
 of this
                                                      
 energy?  Let
                                                       us
 look at
                                                   a
 very simple
                                                      
 example of heating
                                                       which
 may explain
                                                      
 this
                                                   process. 
                                                      
 When
                                                      
 sunlight strikes
                                                       an
 absorbing
                                                      
 surface it is
                                                   heated
                                                      
 because electrons
                                                       in the
 material
                                                       are
 converted to
                                                   photons which
                                                       are
 emitted in the
                                                      
 infrared band of
                                                      
 light
                                                   leaving the
                                                      
 material in a net
                                                      
 positive state or
                                                      
 hot.  The
                                                   more
                                                      
 electrons a
                                                      
 material loses the
                                                       hotter
 it becomes. 
                                                      
 Now
                                                   the inverse
                                                      
 situation is
                                                      
 explored by
                                                      
 evaporating some
                                                      
 water
                                                   from the
                                                      
 surface of a
                                                      
 material which
                                                       leaves
 the surface
                                                       in
 a
                                                   net negative
                                                       state
 or cold. 
                                                      
 Heat or
                                                       cold
 is based on
                                                      
 the
                                                   ion
                                                      
 relationship in
                                                       the
 material. 
                                                      
 When we
                                                       apply
 a flame
                                                   (ionizing) to
                                                       a
 material we
                                                       cause
 the emission
                                                       of
 photons
                                                   which is
                                                      
 basically
                                                      
 stripping away
                                                      
 electrons from the
                                                      
 atomic
                                                   structure
                                                      
 causing a gross
                                                       net
 positive
                                                      
 situation to
                                                      
 occur.
                                                   Now we are
                                                      
 getting a picture
                                                       as to
 how an
                                                      
 electric current
                                                   across the
                                                      
 Peltier junction
                                                       can
 transport
                                                      
 thermal energy
                                                   (ions). 
                                                      
 Since the
                                                       energy
 is in the
                                                       form
 of presence
                                                      
 or
                                                   absence of
                                                      
 electrons then it
                                                       is a
 simple
                                                      
 explanation as to
                                                   how the
                                                      
 process works. 
                                                      
 All phase
                                                       change
 processes
                                                       work
 the
                                                   same way
                                                      
 basically via ion
                                                      
 transport and are
                                                       not
 mechanical
                                                   processes
                                                       which
 we were
                                                      
 taught.  Everything 
                                                      
 in
                                                      
 chemistry is
                                                   an electrical
                                                       or
 electrostatic
                                                      
 process at the
                                                       atomic
 level
                                                   based on the
                                                      
 ionized state of
                                                       the
 atoms
                                                      
 involved.
                                                   At a Vanguard
                                                      
 Science Roundtable
                                                      
 discussion several
                                                       years
 ago
                                                   we talked
                                                       about
 the ion wind
                                                       method
 of fire
                                                      
 fighting in
                                                   which ionized
                                                       air
 will
                                                      
 extinguish a flame
                                                      
 because of the
                                                   cooling
                                                      
 effects.  Now
                                                       we see
 Patents
                                                       issued
 based on
                                                   negative ion
                                                      
 spraying of a
                                                      
 surface causing it
                                                       to
 rapidly
                                                   cool because
                                                       it
 becomes net
                                                      
 negative charged. 
                                                      
 This is a
                                                   very
                                                      
 efficient method
                                                       of
                                                      
 air-conditioning
                                                      
 because an ion
                                                   generator
                                                     operates
 at very
                                                     high
 voltages with
                                                     very
 little
                                                   
 
                                                   current
                                                      
 involved.  
                                                      
 It is
                                                      
 possible to
                                                      
 develop this ion
                                                   transport
                                                      
 (thermal energy)
                                                       to
 provide direct
                                                      
 electrical
                                                   output from
                                                       very
 subtle
                                                      
 temperature
                                                      
 differentials. 
                                                      
 Remember
                                                   that this is
                                                       a
 direct
                                                      
 reversible process
                                                       where
 a thermal
                                                   differential
                                                       will
 cause a
                                                      
 development of
                                                      
 current and
                                                      
 voltage
                                                   as in the
                                                      
 Peltier device.  
                                                      
 I hope that
                                                       this
 dialog will
                                                   provide some
                                                       food
 for thought
                                                       out
 there on the
                                                       Keely
 Net.
                                                   Please
                                                      
 provide some
                                                      
 feedback on this
                                                       very
 interesting
                                                      
 line
                                                   of
                                                      
 experimentation.  
                                                      
 Norm
                                                    
                                                   
 
                                                   
                                                     On
                                                      
 7/7/2018 5:38 PM,
                                                       [email protected]
 [EVGRAY] wrote:
 
                                                     
                                                    
   
                                                       
                                                        
 Norm, 
                                                        
 
 
                                                          
 Part of
                                                          
 your heat
                                                          
 treatise was
                                                          
 evaporated by
                                                          
 yahoo, feel
                                                          
 free to send
                                                           to
 my email,
                                                          
 very
                                                          
 interesting
                                                          
 topic that
                                                          
 bummed me out
                                                          
 when I hit
                                                          
 "Would" and
                                                          
 nothing
                                                          
 further!
                                                          
 
 
                                                          
 
                                                          
 In
                                                          
 respect to my
                                                          
 wireless
                                                          
 energy
                                                          
 experiment I
                                                          
 have found PNP
                                                           to
 be superior
                                                           to
 NPN, maybe
                                                          
 they shut off
                                                          
 faster being
                                                          
 always on or
                                                          
 maybe the end
                                                          
 result is more
                                                          
 hole ish.
                                                          
 
 
                                                          
 
                                                          
 
 
                                                          
 
                                                          
 
 
                                                          
 
                                                          
 
 
                                                          
 
                                                          
 
 
                                                          
 
                                                        
 
                                                       
                                                    
 
                                                   
                                                   
 
                                                 
                                               
                                             
                                           
                                         
                                       
                                     
                                   
                                 
                               
                             
                             
 
                           
                         
                       
                     
                   
                 
               
             
           
           
       
       
       
       
     
     
 
   
 
 
 
     
      
 
     
     
 
 
 
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