Re: [EVGRAY] GaryP circuit #1

Hi Warren
Shoukd be fine i think golden motor also 3ph type so overlapping phases coukd muck it up so try just one phas connected to load.
Any motor with permamemt maget rotor will have some rpm with delayed lenz effect. Way i undestand it at least
Norman did it with Kollmogen brushed pancake servo.motor stepped up to 14000 rpm with RV motor as prime mover...draw went down to motor whem.load applied.
..also depends on resistive load what that is plus how fast it must go to work. Watch those videos i sent feel confidemt you can do.it first maybe....for looping i think belting up with step up pulleys the key also so.prime mover operates at most effeciemt power input and rpms so looping possible.
I dont tbink flywheels so imortant all you need to do is defeat lenz law.
Kone

Hi Warren
Yes less drag and lenz law braking from the generator means less amp draw to prime mover 
BUT i have made motors that when you grab shaft and pit a bit of  load on it,  amp draw now goes DOWN so this lower amp draw is not the only way to detect lenz law so rpm meter is necessary...with DC motor prime mover you shpuld see slow  rise in rpms like in Woopy video...in RV motors you can only go7% out of AC sinewave and it stalls.  but RV is very good test machine for no lenz generator since shaft is so sensitie tot finger touch drag on it ypu see increased draw veey quickly.
Just from sound amd pitch you cam tel quickly if you have somwthing or nol too.
Kone

DougIs it a correct assumption when the amperage draw to the prime motor, does not increase, or maybe goes down, that the load has less drag.A simple way to measure load might be nice, like what is done with RV.Cheers Warren

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  On Wed, 27 Feb 2019 at 3:13 AM, [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Hi Warren
Shoukd be fine i think golden motor also 3ph type so overlapping phases coukd muck it up so try just one phas connected to load.
Any motor with permamemt maget rotor will have some rpm with delayed lenz effect. Way i undestand it at least
Norman did it with Kollmogen brushed pancake servo.motor stepped up to 14000 rpm with RV motor as prime mover...draw went down to motor whem.load applied.
...also depends on resistive load what that is plus how fast it must go to work. Watch those videos i sent feel confidemt you can do.it first maybe....for looping i think belting up with step up pulleys the key also so.prime mover operates at most effeciemt power input and rpms so looping possible.
I dont tbink flywheels so imortant all you need to do is defeat lenz law.
Kone

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DougSo what you are saying is first get that rpm noted, using a variable speed DC motor, then come back to the problem using an RV fitted with the sizes of pulley and belt combo to get that exact same rpm to the generator/ motor. Then one should be able to put loads on generator and not see the amperage rise to the RV.?I have a digital tac,  as well as an old fashioned mechanical Stuart Warner shaft tac, so I should have that problem covered.I have a huge collection of vee belt pulleys for just such an occasionCheers Warren.
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  On Wed, 27 Feb 2019 at 12:54 PM, [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Hi Warren
Yes less drag and lenz law braking from the generator means less amp draw to prime mover 
BUT i have made motors that when you grab shaft and pit a bit of load on it, amp draw now goes DOWN so this lower amp draw is not the only way to detect lenz law so rpm meter is necessary...with DC motor prime mover you shpuld see slow rise in rpms like in Woopy video...in RV motors you can only go7% out of AC sinewave and it stalls. but RV is very good test machine for no lenz generator since shaft is so sensitie tot finger touch drag on it ypu see increased draw veey quickly.
Just from sound amd pitch you cam tel quickly if you have somwthing or nol too.
Kone
 
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Hi Warren
Yes somehow find that window of rpm first then work it all around that
Kone

Kono
Can you post the PDF on this forum email .I can't access the general forum
on Yahoo .not for years
On Feb 27, 2019 1:37 PM, "[email protected] [EVGRAY]" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>
> Hi Warren
> Yes somehow find that window of rpm first then work it all around that
> Kone
> 
>

DougThe more I think about this phenomenon, a certain frequency, or magnetic ripple, that defies Lenz, the more interesting it becomes.You have to admit it is freaky, as it were. Are there any academic scientific studies on this?What is it called?Cheers Warren

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  .On Wed, 27 Feb 2019 at 2:37 PM, [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Hi Warren
Yes somehow find that window of rpm first then work it all around that
Kone

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Hi Warren 
It,s called delayed lenz effect.
For rotatig stuff it seems evenly spaced 
magnet rotors inducing generator coils are necessary.
The lenz braking takes some time to manifest to a strong backwards force, and with just the right speed to the sweep of the rotor magnets, the coil haz its lenz brakinv of rotor magnets manifest at advemtagous position to rotor magnet, in not slowing the rotor thrpugh.a backwards-pulling magnetic force.
Never thought  about ripple effect but with evemly.placed magnets in rotorr and a steady speefd to rotation it wpuld be a steady ripple to the slight time delay of lenz force ypu are going to need "laying on top" of the trailing magmet EDGE so it pushes magnet forward not pulling it backwards.
Thane Karl Heins is the person you would want to study...i sent link anout the theory and math in you tube video about two days sgo.
I dont think they will be allowed to teach this in schools as knowlege and expert practice makes for self running looping motor generators to be too common place.
Thane is or was a teacher up in Ottawa so thetez got to be some studemts besides internet study.
Kone

Hi James
I just sent the pdf to here, and I see attachment icon but then i cannot open it.  Maube ypu can
I alwayz havee trouble  sending attachments in email to here so I dont know but maybe you can see ut.
Look on you tube type in Don Smith #201 
and you will see him.explaining his schematics.
He says to send him email if you want schematics. Also he reafs and answefs youtube commenrs as well.
His email:
[email protected]
Kone

DougI never thought about where Thane lives. He is not so from here, where we have moved, compared to TorontoPerhaps, it might be possible to visit him, to discuss this..Of course, this should be on the curriculum, if experimental models are available. What's the problem with smart, well educated students?We need them now, more than ever, all of us.Thank you for your words of encouragement.With the Golden Motor, there are five tiny hall effect wires coming out of the armature, in addition to the three big primary power wires of the three phases.When the wheel is turned, each phase wire carries a voltage signal to each other of the two wires, when I check with a multimeter.This is a bit confusing for me as I think of changing the output to DC.I guess there will be diodes every which way in order to sort through this mess to make DC.Now, you are suggesting I just do one set. I now see why.I should use a single diode perhaps, rather than a bridge rectifier, though I am still noodling this out.Cheers Warren

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 at 1:00 AM, [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Hi Warren 
It,s called delayed lenz effect.
For rotatig stuff it seems evenly spaced 
magnet rotors inducing generator coils are necessary.
The lenz braking takes some time to manifest to a strong backwards force, and with just the right speed to the sweep of the rotor magnets, the coil haz its lenz brakinv of rotor magnets manifest at advemtagous position to rotor magnet, in not slowing the rotor thrpugh.a backwards-pulling magnetic force.
Never thought about ripple effect but with evemly.placed magnets in rotorr and a steady speefd to rotation it wpuld be a steady ripple to the slight time delay of lenz force ypu are going to need "laying on top" of the trailing magmet EDGE so it pushes magnet forward not pulling it backwards.
Thane Karl Heins is the person you would want to study...i sent link anout the theory and math in you tube video about two days sgo.
I dont think they will be allowed to teach this in schools as knowlege and expert practice makes for self running looping motor generators to be too common place.
Thane is or was a teacher up in Ottawa so thetez got to be some studemts besides internet study.
Kone

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DougWhat about those embedded hall effect sensors? Should I just ignore them for now? They are just five tiny TTL wires coming out of the armature magnet wire coils.I assume  there are transistors stuck inside somewhere in there, but they shouldn' t be relevant for this test.I have to get belts and pulleys on all of this, and get it securely mounted to a DC driver motor.Cheers Warren 

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 at 7:17 AM, Warren Keillor [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Doug
I never thought about where Thane lives. He is not so from here, where we have moved, compared to TorontoPerhaps, it might be possible to visit him, to discuss this..Of course, this should be on the curriculum, if experimental models are available. What's the problem with smart, well educated students?We need them now, more than ever, all of us.Thank you for your words of encouragement.With the Golden Motor, there are five tiny hall effect wires coming out of the armature, in addition to the three big primary power wires of the three phases.When the wheel is turned, each phase wire carries a voltage signal to each other of the two wires, when I check with a multimeter.This is a bit confusing for me as I think of changing the output to DC.I guess there will be diodes every which way in order to sort through this mess to make DC.Now, you are suggesting I just do one set. I now see why.I should use a single diode perhaps, rather than a bridge rectifier, though I am still noodling this out.Cheers Warren

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 at 1:00 AM, [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Hi Warren 
It,s called delayed lenz effect.
For rotatig stuff it seems evenly spaced 
magnet rotors inducing generator coils are necessary.
The lenz braking takes some time to manifest to a strong backwards force, and with just the right speed to the sweep of the rotor magnets, the coil haz its lenz brakinv of rotor magnets manifest at advemtagous position to rotor magnet, in not slowing the rotor thrpugh.a backwards-pulling magnetic force.
Never thought about ripple effect but with evemly.placed magnets in rotorr and a steady speefd to rotation it wpuld be a steady ripple to the slight time delay of lenz force ypu are going to need "laying on top" of the trailing magmet EDGE so it pushes magnet forward not pulling it backwards.
Thane Karl Heins is the person you would want to study...i sent link anout the theory and math in you tube video about two days sgo.
I dont think they will be allowed to teach this in schools as knowlege and expert practice makes for self running looping motor generators to be too common place.
Thane is or was a teacher up in Ottawa so thetez got to be some studemts besides internet study.
Kone

    
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