Solar panel neutral spike

Staying at a friends who had PV solar installed.  When they were away
they came back and found a power strip melted that went to a treadmill
and a few of the ceiling fan controllers burned out.  Began to check the
circuit and found the ground wire from the Sunny Boy inverter cut at the
sheath inside the service panel.  The solar panels are about 100 yards
from the house and grounded to the concrete sunk racks, I really think
there should be a dedicated grounding rod also, but the grounding wire
inside the feed to the pair of breakers just cut not bonded to the
panel.  I am pretty sure this is against code besides being a hazard. 
Likely a lightening strike nearby pushed a nice big pulse through the
neutral wire and reflected off the inductive loads.

I am furious at this kind of stupidity but before I give hell to the
installer I want to make sure my thinking is correct.  Perhaps Dave can
give his two cents if for any reason the inverter should be floated like
this instead of bonded to the panel.

There seems to be a controversy on the topic:

https://www.solarpaneltalk.com/forum/solar-panels-for-home/solar-panel-system-equipment/16949-grounding-code-690-47-c-3-implementation-with-sma-sunnyboy-tl-us-22

MickI have been running my schooner's electrical system using PV panels on a 12 volt system charging golf cart batteries. It seems to be trouble free, so far. The batteries have been always fully charged.Thete are two metal masts rising up six and a half stories from the deck. The half inch stainless steel rigging conducts to ground via the ferro cement hull which seems to be always at the same potential as the water, when I have measured it.
I have been in some very frightening lightning storms in the Gulf  Stream, and the East Coast of the US, being the tallest structure on the horizon.I have heard that there is a sixty degree cone of protection afforded such installations around vessels.My experience, scary as it was, seemed to bear this out.Lighning repeatedly struck the water on all sides around the boat for hours on end with deafening noise and hissing trails of bubbles, like snakes on the water, at the point of impact.Somehow in these storms, I had no electronics, or electrical damage.I would not bet on it always working, but it worked for me.Cheers Warren
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sat, 25 Aug 2018 at 8:26 PM, Mick [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Staying at a friends who had PV solar installed.  When they were away
they came back and found a power strip melted that went to a treadmill
and a few of the ceiling fan controllers burned out.  Began to check the
circuit and found the ground wire from the Sunny Boy inverter cut at the
sheath inside the service panel.  The solar panels are about 100 yards
from the house and grounded to the concrete sunk racks, I really think
there should be a dedicated grounding rod also, but the grounding wire
inside the feed to the pair of breakers just cut not bonded to the
panel.  I am pretty sure this is against code besides being a hazard. 
Likely a lightening strike nearby pushed a nice big pulse through the
neutral wire and reflected off the inductive loads.

I am furious at this kind of stupidity but before I give hell to the
installer I want to make sure my thinking is correct.  Perhaps Dave can
give his two cents if for any reason the inverter should be floated like
this instead of bonded to the panel.

There seems to be a controversy on the topic:

https://www.solarpaneltalk.com/forum/solar-panels-for-home/solar-panel-system-equipment/16949-grounding-code-690-47-c-3-implementation-with-sma-sunnyboy-tl-us-22


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Have you tried it on a water spout yet ? 😁
On Aug 26, 2018 2:25 AM, "Warren Keillor [email protected]
[EVGRAY]" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
> Mick
> I have been running my schooner's electrical system using PV panels on a
> 12 volt system charging golf cart batteries. It seems to be trouble free,
> so far. The batteries have been always fully charged.
> Thete are two metal masts rising up six and a half stories from the deck.
> The half inch stainless steel rigging conducts to ground via the ferro
> cement hull which seems to be always at the same potential as the water,
> when I have measured it.
> I have been in some very frightening lightning storms in the Gulf  Stream,
> and the East Coast of the US, being the tallest structure on the horizon.
> I have heard that there is a sixty degree cone of protection afforded such
> installations around vessels.
> My experience, scary as it was, seemed to bear this out.
> Lighning repeatedly struck the water on all sides around the boat for
> hours on end with deafening noise and hissing trails of bubbles, like
> snakes on the water, at the point of impact.
> Somehow in these storms, I had no electronics, or electrical damage.
> I would not bet on it always working, but it worked for me.
> Cheers Warren
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> <https://go.onelink.me/107872968?pid=InProduct&c=Global_Internal_YGrowth_AndroidEmailSig__AndroidUsers&af_wl=ym&af_sub1=Internal&af_sub2=Global_YGrowth&af_sub3=EmailSignature>
>
> On Sat, 25 Aug 2018 at 8:26 PM, Mick [email protected] [EVGRAY]
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
> Staying at a friends who had PV solar installed.  When they were away
> they came back and found a power strip melted that went to a treadmill
> and a few of the ceiling fan controllers burned out.  Began to check the
> circuit and found the ground wire from the Sunny Boy inverter cut at the
> sheath inside the service panel.  The solar panels are about 100 yards
> from the house and grounded to the concrete sunk racks, I really think
> there should be a dedicated grounding rod also, but the grounding wire
> inside the feed to the pair of breakers just cut not bonded to the
> panel.  I am pretty sure this is against code besides being a hazard.
> Likely a lightening strike nearby pushed a nice big pulse through the
> neutral wire and reflected off the inductive loads.
>
> I am furious at this kind of stupidity but before I give hell to the
> installer I want to make sure my thinking is correct.  Perhaps Dave can
> give his two cents if for any reason the inverter should be floated like
> this instead of bonded to the panel.
>
> There seems to be a controversy on the topic:
>
> https://www.solarpaneltalk.com/forum/solar-panels-for-
> home/solar-panel-system-equipment/16949-grounding-code-690-47-c-3-
> implementation-with-sma-sunnyboy-tl-us-22
>
> 
>

JamesYou don't go looking for interesting weather when in a boat. You do your best to avoid it.But just like politics, or other large features of the landscape, sometimes it just happens. We do our best as we see it, using our best survival skills. A fhunderstorm that has lighning hitting very close to you, for hours at a time, with no break in the sound, the hair on your arms standing out straight in the charged atmosphere, is not a situation one chooses to be in, but being on the water, like being in a spacecraft, is a bubble of reality, you live in, or not.
And yes, twin waterspouts between the Guadalope and the Saints, each appearing out of a black cloud that seemed a mile up traveling West, one right after the other, coming out of what seemed like the same place in the sky. It may have been the high masses of both Island groups and the narrow channel between them after the broad Atlantic. We cut the interval between them by chance, on our way to the Saints.Cheers Warren
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sun, 26 Aug 2018 at 6:31 PM, James Glinski [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       


Have you tried it on a water spout yet ? 😁
On Aug 26, 2018 2:25 AM, "Warren Keillor [email protected] [EVGRAY]" <[email protected]> wrote:

     

MickI have been running my schooner's electrical system using PV panels on a 12 volt system charging golf cart batteries. It seems to be trouble free, so far. The batteries have been always fully charged.Thete are two metal masts rising up six and a half stories from the deck. The half inch stainless steel rigging conducts to ground via the ferro cement hull which seems to be always at the same potential as the water, when I have measured it.
I have been in some very frightening lightning storms in the Gulf  Stream, and the East Coast of the US, being the tallest structure on the horizon.I have heard that there is a sixty degree cone of protection afforded such installations around vessels.My experience, scary as it was, seemed to bear this out.Lighning repeatedly struck the water on all sides around the boat for hours on end with deafening noise and hissing trails of bubbles, like snakes on the water, at the point of impact.Somehow in these storms, I had no electronics, or electrical damage..I would not bet on it always working, but it worked for me.Cheers Warren
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sat, 25 Aug 2018 at 8:26 PM, Mick [email protected] [EVGRAY]<[email protected]> wrote:       
Staying at a friends who had PV solar installed.  When they were away
they came back and found a power strip melted that went to a treadmill
and a few of the ceiling fan controllers burned out.  Began to check the
circuit and found the ground wire from the Sunny Boy inverter cut at the
sheath inside the service panel.  The solar panels are about 100 yards
from the house and grounded to the concrete sunk racks, I really think
there should be a dedicated grounding rod also, but the grounding wire
inside the feed to the pair of breakers just cut not bonded to the
panel.  I am pretty sure this is against code besides being a hazard. 
Likely a lightening strike nearby pushed a nice big pulse through the
neutral wire and reflected off the inductive loads.

I am furious at this kind of stupidity but before I give hell to the
installer I want to make sure my thinking is correct.  Perhaps Dave can
give his two cents if for any reason the inverter should be floated like
this instead of bonded to the panel.

There seems to be a controversy on the topic:

https://www.solarpaneltalk. com/forum/solar-panels-for- home/solar-panel-system- equipment/16949-grounding- code-690-47-c-3- implementation-with-sma- sunnyboy-tl-us-22


    
   
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http://www.shipbuildinghistory.com/shipyards/emergencylarge/wwtwoconcrete.htm 
Warren, your ferro-cement boat brings back fond memories of my Great 
Uncle Brian who worked at the Ship Yard in Tampa FL. building the 
concrete ships shown here!


On 8/27/2018 3:36 AM, Warren Keillor [email protected] 
[EVGRAY] wrote:
>
> James
>
> You don't go looking for interesting weather when in a boat. You do 
> your best to avoid it.
> But just like politics, or other large features of the landscape, 
> sometimes it just happens. We do our best as we see it, using our best 
> survival skills.
> A fhunderstorm that has lighning hitting very close to you, for hours 
> at a time, with no break in the sound, the hair on your arms standing 
> out straight in the charged atmosphere, is not a situation one chooses 
> to be in, but being on the water, like being in a spacecraft, is a 
> bubble of reality, you live in, or not.
> And yes, twin waterspouts between the Guadalope and the Saints, each 
> appearing out of a black cloud that seemed a mile up traveling West, 
> one right after the other, coming out of what seemed like the same 
> place in the sky. It may have been the high masses of both Island 
> groups and the narrow channel between them after the broad Atlantic. 
> We cut the interval between them by chance, on our way to the Saints.
> Cheers Warren
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
> <https://go.onelink.me/107872968?pid=InProduct&c=Global_Internal_YGrowth_AndroidEmailSig__AndroidUsers&af_wl=ym&af_sub1=Internal&af_sub2=Global_YGrowth&af_sub3=EmailSignature>
>
>     On Sun, 26 Aug 2018 at 6:31 PM, James Glinski [email protected]
>     [EVGRAY]
>     <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>     Have you tried it on a water spout yet ? 😁
>
>     On Aug 26, 2018 2:25 AM, "Warren Keillor
>     [email protected]
>     <mailto:[email protected]> [EVGRAY]"
>     <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>
>         Mick
>         I have been running my schooner's electrical system using PV
>         panels on a 12 volt system charging golf cart batteries. It
>         seems to be trouble free, so far. The batteries have been
>         always fully charged.
>         Thete are two metal masts rising up six and a half stories
>         from the deck. The half inch stainless steel rigging conducts
>         to ground via the ferro cement hull which seems to be always
>         at the same potential as the water, when I have measured it.
>         I have been in some very frightening lightning storms in the
>         Gulf  Stream, and the East Coast of the US, being the tallest
>         structure on the horizon.
>         I have heard that there is a sixty degree cone of protection
>         afforded such installations around vessels.
>         My experience, scary as it was, seemed to bear this out.
>         Lighning repeatedly struck the water on all sides around the
>         boat for hours on end with deafening noise and hissing trails
>         of bubbles, like snakes on the water, at the point of impact.
>         Somehow in these storms, I had no electronics, or electrical
>         damage..
>         I would not bet on it always working, but it worked for me.
>         Cheers Warren
>         Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
>         <https://go.onelink.me/107872968?pid=InProduct&c=Global_Internal_YGrowth_AndroidEmailSig__AndroidUsers&af_wl=ym&af_sub1=Internal&af_sub2=Global_YGrowth&af_sub3=EmailSignature>
>
>             On Sat, 25 Aug 2018 at 8:26 PM, Mick [email protected]
>             <mailto:[email protected]> [EVGRAY]
>             <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
>             wrote:
>
>             Staying at a friends who had PV solar installed. When they
>             were away
>             they came back and found a power strip melted that went to
>             a treadmill
>             and a few of the ceiling fan controllers burned out. Began
>             to check the
>             circuit and found the ground wire from the Sunny Boy
>             inverter cut at the
>             sheath inside the service panel.  The solar panels are
>             about 100 yards
>             from the house and grounded to the concrete sunk racks, I
>             really think
>             there should be a dedicated grounding rod also, but the
>             grounding wire
>             inside the feed to the pair of breakers just cut not
>             bonded to the
>             panel.  I am pretty sure this is against code besides
>             being a hazard.
>             Likely a lightening strike nearby pushed a nice big pulse
>             through the
>             neutral wire and reflected off the inductive loads.
>
>             I am furious at this kind of stupidity but before I give
>             hell to the
>             installer I want to make sure my thinking is correct.
>             Perhaps Dave can
>             give his two cents if for any reason the inverter should
>             be floated like
>             this instead of bonded to the panel.
>
>             There seems to be a controversy on the topic:
>
>             https://www.solarpaneltalk. com/forum/solar-panels-for-
>             home/solar-panel-system- equipment/16949-grounding-
>             code-690-47-c-3- implementation-with-sma-
>             sunnyboy-tl-us-22
>             <https://www.solarpaneltalk.com/forum/solar-panels-for-home/solar-panel-system-equipment/16949-grounding-code-690-47-c-3-implementation-with-sma-sunnyboy-tl-us-22>
>
>

Norman,
 

 Interesting then that some of those ships ended their days in Canada
 

 http://www.concreteships.org/ships/powellriver/ http://www.concreteships.org/ships/powellriver/

 

 Ron

Woo man if you could of got that on film .you might of been sailing but
when you saw that I bet you wished you could fly away . that how those
story's about fish raining from heaven happen ...up then down
On Aug 27, 2018 11:29 AM, "[email protected] [EVGRAY]" <
[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
>
> Norman,
>
> Interesting then that some of those ships ended their days in Canada
>
> http://www.concreteships.org/ships/powellriver/
>
> Ron
> 
>

Thanks!  Did not know where they finally resided!    Great Uncle died a 
long time ago!   Visited Tampa FL. in 1946 after the war and although a 
tike at the time, remember seeing the ship yard where he worked!


On 8/27/2018 11:29 AM, [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>
>
> Norman,
>
> Interesting then that some of those ships ended their days in Canada
>
> http://www.concreteships.org/ships/powellriver/
>
> Ron
>