Body
Mick! Just had to laugh at your remark about floating grounds in the
recording studio! Ha! Ha! Way back when I was learning about fine
audio, I ran a shielded line level audio cable to hook two sound systems
together, about 100 ft run. When I turned on the systems and selected
line in on the 2nd system, I had the prettiest motor boat you ever
heard! Lol Yep! I had grounded both ends of a shielded cable and got a
good example of a ground loop!
On 11/3/2018 4:54 PM, Mick [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>
> Norm,
>
> Thanks for that.
>
> I love Mr Calrsons lab, I could happily live there for quite awhile
> with all that awesome vintage gear. I have seen isolation
> transformers wired like that and it's so insane but I am used to
> testing all the grounding points. When building a recording studio we
> have to float all the grounds so they are single point at the service
> panel and not looped anywhere else. Often they are lifted at the
> outlet j-box due to the lack of control in a prewired building.
> Ironically we also used to use autoformers for all of the light
> dimmers to prevent noise, so we often referred to the variacs as light
> dimmers.
>
> I still don't completely trust a scope on an isolation transformer
> even if the ground is properly isolated/ lifted due to the somewhat
> rare magnetic emp events we are talking about like when I kicked off
> all my ground faults in the house through one.
>
>
> On 11/3/2018 2:03 PM, Norman Wootan [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>
>> Mick! Here is a helpful video regarding scopes and isolation
>> transformers on the test bench!
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBsQ3sZ45Fk&feature=youtu.be
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaELqAo4kkQ
>>
>>
>> On 11/3/2018 12:36 PM, Mick [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>>
>>> Norm,
>>>
>>> Thanks for the nudge in the right direction. Now the process
>>> demands repeating with a totally isolated battery source configured
>>> the same way. Funny how I was concentrating on isolating and
>>> connecting saturated inductive charge without the first magnetic
>>> variable taken into account.
>>>
>>> I have had no problem creating the event with my grid power source
>>> and even warned Sven that an isolation transformer will not always
>>> protect his scope when messing around with this energy. My scope
>>> probe sitting on a bench shot me in the leg when I walked by when
>>> performing the experiments from my bench supply. The bench supply
>>> has an isolation transformer of sorts. Being it is torroidal there
>>> is more inter-winding capacitive coupling and mutual inductance than
>>> with the proper EI transformer though there is at least the
>>> electrostatic shield and galvanic isolation.
>>>
>>> Thanks for that reference. the Brit guy was funny, although I'm very
>>> familiar with iso transformers in audio work used for galvanic
>>> isolation and balancing to eliminate common mode noise.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/3/2018 4:42 AM, Norman Wootan [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Mick! Your DUH reference is funny! To understand Isolation,
>>>> best to study and understand the Isolation Transformer. The super
>>>> high quality ones are built to eliminate noise and DC components
>>>> that effect sensitive instruments like EEG and EKG instruments.
>>>> This will give you an idea as to construction and purpose::
>>>>
>>>> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isolation_transformer
>>>>
>>>> A little tutorial as to how they work!
>>>>
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfzy5IQMzyc&feature=youtu.be
>>>>
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14kPQif9P7c&feature=youtu.be
>>>>
>>>> https://toroid.com/Products/Medical-Isolation-Transformers
>>>>
>>>> The 230VAC, 5 HP locked rotor experiment was an example of
>>>> electrically isolated electrical circuitry when mains contactor was
>>>> opened since there was no neutral involve. There is magnetic and
>>>> capacitive coup[ling only The dielectric insulation was not
>>>> compromised therefore no electrical connection. The Chinese motor
>>>> experiment was isolated, (electrically) when the reversing action
>>>> was in transient. (Floating neutral) since there is a line neutral
>>>> in the 120VAC input.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 11/2/2018 2:44 PM, Mick [email protected] [EVGRAY] wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Norm,
>>>>>
>>>>> Since you have performed mass research on this event would you concur
>>>>> with my long distance observation that the event is not only due to
>>>>> charge isolation but inclusive of a magnetic connection from source in
>>>>> addition to the saturated and lifted inductive load?
>>>>>
>>>>> Your bell buzzer and bell transformer acting as an isolation
>>>>> transformer.
>>>>>
>>>>> Both motor experiments, the small Emerson type and the HVAC unit with
>>>>> only two hot's no neutral, must have been powered by an isolation
>>>>> transformer of some type also such as the utility step down for the
>>>>> neighborhood or dedicated delta or wye for commercial or even acted as
>>>>> such from the dual windings of the HVAC motor.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you reliably produced the NS from any type of isolated battery
>>>>> system, or in all such cases was there a magnetic connection to an
>>>>> earth
>>>>> bonding in another spot?
>>>>>
>>>>> My thoughts being one side of a transformer acting as a source is
>>>>> grounded and the secondary side isolated so that the only conceivable
>>>>> ground bonding on the sink might be considered as magnetic aside from
>>>>> the bonded motor frame or what not producing the reconnection.
>>>>>
>>>>> I may be pissing up a rope notwithstanding the NS seems to be
>>>>> predicated
>>>>> on a B field connection somewhere in the source feed though the
>>>>> neutral
>>>>> is isolated electrically.
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps this is a simple "Duh" to you that you had already figured out
>>>>> assuming everyone else at least this smart. Either way it does create
>>>>> an interesting position in which to view 3 phase and transformers with
>>>>> an extra resonant winding.
>>>>>
>>>>> By the way, ironic your implication that the large medical isolation
>>>>> transformers create a heretofore unknown vector of extreme danger.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mick
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>