Body
Hi Kone,
An easy way to measure the energy of a flyback pulse is to dump the energy into a capacitor through a diode. When the capacitance of the capacitor is known and the voltage across it it is very easy to calculate the energy it stores. If no resistance is involved the energy is pure reactive and can be taken out of the capacitor again. If there is resistance like using copper wires some of the energy will be dissipated as heat (active power) and thus won't be reactive.
If doubting the formulas then try the experiment with a digital storage oscilloscope having math capabilities and hooked up as a power meter. If the formulas don't fit we will have to find the correct formula to substitute the wrong one. Of course the measuring equipment will have to be calibrated to fit the formulas which can be done against national or international standards. Cheaper instruments may be accurate to perhaps 5 percent. Read the manual.
A free energy device capable of running itself and perhaps being able to deliver some active power like driving a light emitting diode can of course be measured. A small load like a LED can be easy measured with the proper equipment. If only having reactive power sloshing back and forth inside a device what is it good for?! Even a solar cell can deliver active power to an external load as long as it receives light of the proper wavelength.
When saying that the energy can't be measured then if an effect can be observed this indicates that some measurement is possible. Galileo formulated that to be called scientific an effect had to be measured. Thus lots of measurement equipment was invented just for that purpose. If the effect can't be measured with existing instruments then make some instrument to measure it. W.B. Smith made his binding force meter http://www.treurniet.ca/Smith/BindingForce.htm even though he didn't find a way to calibrate the scale against some other known units. Here is an effect open for inventors to perfect this binding force meter. This could be useful for construction calculations to know the strength needed. The binding force could be plotted like the temperature to study its fluctuations or to see when atomic explosions have weakened the binding field to be able to warn against earth quakes.
"One more thing is I think looking at flyback energy as only voltage is big mistake since introduce just the two components offices and caps and it can transform to huge amperage."
For electrical work (changing energy of one kind into another kind) current (amp) tension (voltage) and time (second) is necessary. For power the time isn't necessary as power is the rate of transferring the energy at any given instant in time. So you're very correct that voltage isn't energy. If knowing the other parameters like the capacitance of the capacitor the energy of a given voltage can be calculated as well as the charge being stored. Or by transferring the energy to a load it could be measured which can be compared to the calculation to see if the formula is correct. This is what is being done in physics classes in schools.
Regards
Ole
---In [email protected], <konehead@...> wrote :
Hi Ole
I don't think flyback energy can be measured properly not even with the fastest scope available
Not only are voltages ghosting on scope but so is the time too.
But one way to measure it is to pop it into suitable lead acid batteries and charge up the batteries with those fly back spikes only.
Then run loads with the charged batteries and run them down until they need to be charged up again.
Do about 20 cycles and keep neasurements how many watts are consumed from the batteries running loads compared to how many watts it took to charge them. With a good charging system like the Bedini wheel you will see overunity.
More believable is simply run let's say electric bicycle motor with a battery A and have flyback energy from dc bike motor charge battery B
And when battery A runs down, have bike motor to now run on battery B...it won't be overunity since bike motor pulls in so much amps, but you have extended the range quite a bit. Now flyback is doing useful work at least, not just snuffed out to protect mosfet gates.
Those flyback spikes will induce their energy into pickup winds, that is, additional winds around or behind or next to, or within, (bifilars) the primary winding that is emergized...and these pickup winds sharing common core.
So combine this pickup-energy induced, with the flyback energy and there is some coherence going on. Just get it going same direction with diodes then deposit into capacitors.
The formulas you give I have doubts about since these will be based on accepted power formulas and for power measurement to be acceptable there must be direct resistive load or there is no power.measured according to what is accepted.
But that is what always kills everything, the direvt rezistive load always "required"
So fill capacitors only and discharge capacitors only in two stage process so only the capacitive discharge is power and watts.
Permeability of cores and resistance of copper.or. steel or aluminum in wires is all about their resistances or acceptance to either magnetic forces or electrical forces and so you cannot have electrical flow without magnetic flow or vice versa so if formulas formulated always on direct resistive loading, either magnetic or electrical, then formulas all flawed since they are concerned with only one approach into "what is" power.
Consider also "what if" the actual inherent backemf forces in magnetic or electrical field can be "seperated" or tricked.into joining forces going same direction as some other electrical force going that same direction as well, instead of always opposing the primary flow? Could this be.measured if this was to happen? Perhaps the good results could.be measured or destructive...
One more thing is I think looking at flyback energy as only voltage is big mistake since introduce just the two components offices and caps and it can transform to huge amperage.
Kone